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BlakeB717 |
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Also relying back to an interview Jeff had; he said JR's initial strategy was to have everyone hate him at the beginning and slowly become more liked and
begin to succeed as the game progressed. I was curious to see if they would purposely edit him negatively at the start, because that would mean they may have
the intention of making him go from N to P, but, I'm still debating whether or not he's been really "N" enough to start that arc. If he is,
it shows longevity, but if it isn't strong enough, then chances are JR won't get very close to winning.
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nikkidj |
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OK, now I want to go to China. I just won't lick any toys while I'm there.
FIE LONG (Notice that they actually perused The Art of War??? I have a feeling this wil come into play in the future, in their favor) Aaron: MOR2. I loved how he got painted into a corner. "I see myself as a leader, but I want to do it as subtly as possible" and then basically gets forced to the limelight by Todd. He also said that he didn't think his tribe knew what it was doing, but then we see them totally out-playing the other tribe in every possible way. I think he's going to get the wool pulled over his eyes, and a lot. Amanda: UTR1. Had a confessional about how Aaron and James were strong, and that's about it. Couldn't pick her out of a line-up at this point. Courtney: MOR2N. I wrote a big "OBNOXIOUS" next to her name. Sorry, hon, but New York City is NOT the end-all-beat-all of the world. And heck, you're a waitress. Get off of your high horse, honey. At least she's interesting, though. I hope they eventually make her comlex, and not a one-note Flicka-type. Oh, and it's not your "own private hell" as we're all forced to view it, honey. Denise: UTRP2. Very positive in her confessional, talking about how the ceremony was spiritual and emotional. She tripped in the RC and kept going, and JP gave her the flint, specifically, keeping her from being a 1. James: UTR2. I don't see how a guy whose only confessional is about how he needs to work on his social game in addition to kicking butt in challenges can be anything but UTR. Heck, all of his sentences are about how he doesn't talk with a lot of people, and how he is used to being by himself. But in a side note, the flexing muscles, pushing down bamboo with his bare hands, and that waaaaaaay sexy voice? I could SO get used to that. Oh, and he was the only member of this tribe not to have a confessional before the first commercial. Jean-Robert: MOR3. Would've been a two if not for his long conversation with Todd. Kept calling Todd out for being clever and devious. Interesting choice of words. There is definitely going to be a future between these two. Leslie: MOR2M. She was negative in that she left the ceremony early, and JP emphasized it even more. It wasn't a worship service, but she was too closed minded to appreciate that. Not a harbinger of good social skills later. Then, she's seen trying to help James with his social game (irony much?) which was positive. For Todd, see following WD report. ZHAN HU: clueless, clueless, clueless. Ashley: MOR3. Irony in that she was all about competition, then got sick and could barely hold up her tiger stick. But as someone who spent 9 months puking, I definitely feel for her. And I think she's even prettier without all of that make-up. Chicken: OTT5N. If only he were more like Chicken George. At least he showed a little self awareness by acknowledging that he didn't fit in. But by focusing on his work ethic and not on the social aspects, he failed to realize what a social game this is. Oh, and if you're going to "straighten up the mess" then help formulate a plan, get in there, and get to it, don't whine about how no one else realizes what a gem you are. [/vent] Dave: MOR3M. He was negative, because he flat-out told Ashley she would NOT get voted off just because she was sick, and then he wrote her name down for that reason. Jerk. But his wilingness to put his butt on the line as leader makes him positive. So mixed. I thought I was going to like the guy at first, but I have a feeling he's going to be a paternalistic jerk. Erik: UTR2. One TCQ about work around camp, and how that factors into the vote. Would've been a 1 if Jamie wasn't so much less visible. Frosti: MOR3. Realizes that he's at a disadvantage because of his age and size, but also realizes that his size and athleticism could help him, especially in challenges. Too bad he can't remember to unlock the stinking door. Jamie: UTR1. "I don't have a bra!" Wet t-shirt contest, anyone? Pei Gee: MOR4N. I don't think her crying about her grandfather is enough to move her to the mixed category. She's arrogant, bossy, and condescending. If you wanna be the leader, then be the leader. She was trying to lead, but then would step back and try to get others to take the heat. Not a very good social beginning. But if those were her own earring design, then she's a very nice designer. Sherea: UTR2. SOOOOOOO not Cirie. She's a southern girl who isn't outdoorsy, and it's way harder than she expected. But she had plenty of time to dance around with the other girls. Gotta give a girl props for all that walking in those shoes. That's difficult even on hard ground. Winner: TODD Also looking good: James, Aaron No way are they winning: Jamie, Erik Too soon to say: everyone else
Last Edited By: nikkidj
09/21/07 12:04 AM.
Edited 3 times.
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nikkidj |
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TODD WATCHDOG REPORT
Can you say winner? The guy is mucho complex, sharp as a tack, and not nearly as annoying as I thought he was going to be. He basically forced Aaron to step out of his comfortable "subtle leader" zone and take the lead. He blatantly acknowledged that by doing so, he could use Aaron as a puppet, and control him. He seems to get along well with his tribe, except for Courtney, and possible RJ, and seems excited that they get along well and work well together. Why do I think he's the winner? A: close up of him kissing the idol, as the scene fades away to commercial. B: His quotes "I really want to be here. I'll do whatever I need to do. I'm here to win a million dollars. That's a looooooootttttt of money" are as close as we got to a Earl-as-king-of-the-mountain moment. However, he could be way too complex, and end up being a big-time distraction. As far as his ratings go, I think he was the only one who was present enough to be complex while not going OTT. And I don't think he was positive or negative at this point, but I do think we're supposed to like him. In the old days, I'd have said he was skewing positive, but that's blasphemy these days, so I'll just say neutral. CP4
Last Edited By: nikkidj
09/22/07 2:20 AM.
Edited 2 times.
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WylDawg |
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Todd is not necessarily the winner just because he's your token Survivor know-it-all player. In fact. they typically get 3rd place.
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nikkidj |
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I agree, WylDog. Hence this quote: However, he could be way too complex, and end up being a big-time distraction
At least there is no one right now who fits the Edgic mold perfectly. It might actually take some work this season. Woo HOO!!! |
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Joss Wolfe |
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"It wasn't a worship service, but she was too closed minded to appreciate that."
Actually the bible states that you should not bow to other idols, let alone worship them. any Christian that would bow is not really Christian. Doesn't anybody remember the story of radshak, mishak, and abednago? |
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nikkidj |
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Actually, it's Shadrack. And Abendego. And I think whether anyone is a Christian or not is between him/her and God. So when asians bow to one another in
greeting, is that the same as worshipping false idols? When dignitaries bow to the Queen, is that idolatry? I'll have to remember that, if I'm ever a
tourist in another religion's house of worship not to nod my head in greeting. Hate to burn in hell for that.
Sorry, you just got my parochial school girl blood a boiling... edited because my spelling stinks at 1am.
Last Edited By: nikkidj
09/21/07 12:03 AM.
Edited 2 times.
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JaMalle |
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I totally agree with Leslie's decision not to go through with the ceremony. I mean, if it's not a religious ceremony, then what is all the bowing for?!
Who/What am I bowing for or to?! I thought she did it respectfully and without making a big scene or deal out of it. I also thought her answer to JP's
question was handled properly. And even if you disagree wtih her leaving, hey, at least she tried to go through with it in the first place! Of course, the
public will see this as being close-minded because that's how America is evolving nowadays. Anti-Christianity is the only form of racism allowed as far as
I'm concerned. : { And come on Nikki, There were idols ALL over the place. lol They were hanging from the walls!
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scepticA |
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Ah, come on. Leslie tried to go in there. It bothered her, she left, didn't make a scene. She acknowledged everything about it, was pretty darn matter of
fact. It didn't seem to matter much to people after that scene, except the NY waitress bitch (compare her whining about bowing a zillion times and them
showing the monk correct her hands.) Then Leslie was either smiling, laughing, or supportive the rest of the way - and the scene with James was rather sweet.
Definitely an M rating. I'm just deciding on whether there was sufficient complexity to warrant a CP. Emotionally, absolutely. But I'm gonna have to
think about it, maybe view again.
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nikkidj |
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JaMalle wrote: I see where you're coming from. She did at least give it a try. At first, I thought that it was wrong to even go in, if she was that against it. But she didn't know what the ceremony was going to be, and couldn't really have predicted what the place was going to look like on the inside. I guess I just wonder if they would have let her watch, and just not participate. I think that would have been a little more respectful, is all. I just get angry when someone effectively calls my spirituality into question because of something I posted. I felt attacked, and attacked back. |
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JaMalle |
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I'm sorry you felt that way Niki! You're right, a person's faith is strictly between him/herself and God. : }
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chaperone |
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On Leslie
Leslie handled it perfectly. She's not close minded or bigoted to not compromise her beliefs. She never forced her beliefs on anyone else in fact the
opposite was done to her. I thought it was dispicable to expect anyone to do that whether they claim "it's not a worship service" or not. One
person's non "worship service" can still be a violation of another person's beliefs. If I ever had a non-Christian friend in my church I
would publicly rebuke any Christians who made them raise their hands during worship so that they fit in, or made them bow their heads during prayer, or made
them do anything just because it's part of our faith. Visitors are allowed always and always allowed to do as they feel comfortable (unless you know like
they're threatening someone or something). When I announce the offering I always say something to the effect of "if you're a guest with us please
feel free to let this pass by you, this is something that we as a community feel called to do."
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I LUV TIJUANA |
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My initial ratings, I used Warrior's visibility to determine the visibility numbers, because he puts a lot of work into determining the numbers everyone
should be given, and I feel they therefore should be abided by. *Even though Erik and Amanda get 2's according to the chart, which is a bit odd, but I can
see it.*
Aaron- MOR3~ Nothing really too special here, he was appointed as their leader. Amanda- UTR2~ I would say UTR1, but like I said I'm going by Warrior's chart, nothing extremely memorable. Courtney- MORN2~ Interesting edit, I find myself liking her wit, a lot actually. Denise- UTR1~ I don't like giving an INV to the opposite tribe in episode one, because they're not expected to get much airtime. James- CPP2~ Are people afraid of giving CP's for less than three? He was CP, no questions asked. Jean-Robert- MOR3~ I saw no tone that others apparently saw. Leslie- CPM3~ After the James thing, I was sure that she was mixed. She was in no way malicious, she was respectful and, the scene with James was a way to develop her as well, we are supposed to like her. Todd- CP4~ Pretty clear cut rating, I see him getting lots of CP's. Ashley- OTT4~ I didn't really see any tone. I could see an M, but no N or P. Chicken- CP5~ No tone here either, in my opinion. Dave- MORP4~ A pretty clear rating to me, I could see a 3, but Warrior's chart says 4. Erik- UTR1~ Not much to discuss. Frosti- MOR2~ Yeah... Jaime- UTR1~ I would give her an INV, but the bra thing stood out to me. We shouldn't be angry to not give out an INV, we should be happy the editors did a better job. Yay! Peih-Gee- CPM4~ Definitely the most intriguing edit. Yay for me being her Watchdog. Sherea- UTR2~ This is the only different thing I will do from Warrior's chart, because I remembered Sherea, I didn't think she was UTR1. That's just upon first viewing.
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James Barber |
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Most of what happened with Leslie in the temple was softened by all those shots of Courtney being rude while the monk had to put up with her. Leslie did leave,
yes, but Courtney made a mockery of the religion. The contrast ended up flattering Leslie, and I think people might remember that contrast over Jeff's
tongue-lashing.
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chad6 |
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Aaron- MOR3 (His edit seemed sort of positive, but not enough to earn a P)
Amanda- UTR1 (I was hoping to see her more. Was she the one to say that Fei Long should read The Art of War. I wonder why they showed that) Courtney- MORN2 (They showed her alot in the beginning and not at all at the end. She is clearly the "villain" of the season. I think she might be actually NN. Every time she spoke is was horrible) Denise- UTR1 (Not much shown here. I thought it was weird consider she looks to be a fan favorite) James- MOR2 (It seemed like they wanted us to like him, but didn't show him enough) Jean-Robert- MOR3 (Seemed to be setting up for a Todd v. J-R rivalry. I could put him as N too, but I don't think the editors wanted him to be N. They just wanted to show us he is a "strategist" because he is a poker player) Leslie- MORM3 (She was disrespectful in the beginning and helpful in the middle) Todd- CP4 (Pretty good edit. Not positive or negative, but he will definitely be a player in this game) Ashley- OTT4 (She was sick and we heard a lot about it. Not negative though.) Chicken- OTTM4 (He seemed really nice and happy in the beginning and it all went down hill from there.) Dave- MOR3 (Seemed kind of evil but not enough to earn an N) Erik- UTR1 (Don't remember much about him.) Frosti- MOR2 (Are we supposed to feel bad for him becuase he's 20?) Jaime- UTR1(I found it kind of funny that the two most neglected castaways,Jaime and Erik, were on the tribe going to Tribal) Peih-Gee- CPN4 (She was "bossy" and annoying) Sherea- MOR2 (I liked her. She seemed like she shouldn't be playing survivor per se, but she seemed to fit in well socially and was having a good time) |
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forweg |
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I'll list them as they come to mind.
Ashley - MORN3: EPMB obviously wanted to give her lots of airtime to please WWE nuts. Otherwise, she's just the somewhat lazy sick girl. Not living up to the hype so far. Chicken - OTTN4: I think he was casted as the token lovable old guy, but he acted like a five year old. PG - CPP4: Got the extremely sappy "my dead grandfather" stuff. We're definitely meant to agree with her about her tribe's laziness, and she scolded Chicken just as the viewer was hoping someone would. Cried to show her vulnerable side. The only negativity came from the already negative Ashley. Likely winner. Jaime - INV1 Erik - UTR1: Got a boring TCQ. Dave - OTT3: The typical EPMB white male leader, yet seems somehow more eccentric. No tone yet. Frosti - MOR2: He got a few chirpy "I'm this" and "I'm that" confessionals to introduce himself. I have a feeling we'll be seeing more of him in the future. Sherea - UTR2: The negative Cirie. Amanda - UTR1 Courtney - OTTN3: She was shown as disrespecting the native culture, which is never good in Survivor. The female Shane. Leslie - CP2M: By contrast, Leslie was shown as having internal doubt, rather than blatant disrespect. She's one of those polarizing characters EPMB sometimes likes to cast. Most of her fellow Christians will love her, while most non-Christians will hate her. James - OTTP2: He fits the "gentle giant" billing to a tee. Finally a black man gets a sympathetic edit. It's difficult to give someone with so little screen time this rating, but I agree with AMAI that it occasionally fits. He was just such a one-dimensional "root for him, please!" edit. Jean-Robert - CPN2: The crude, irritating strategist. The poker thing is played up as expected. Likely long-term relationship with Todd. Todd - CPP3: The likable, earnest strategist. Likely long-term relationship with Jean-Robert. I agree with Pulau Tiga that it's not necessarily a winner's edit. Aaron - MOR3: Another typical EPMB white male leader, but he seems a little more clueless than Dave. Comparisons should be interesting. Denise - UTRP1: She'll fit right into the Cirie/Yau-Man mold I'm sure, but nothing much this episode. Winner pick: PG. She fits perfectly thus far.
Last Edited By: forweg
09/21/07 5:03 AM.
Edited 2 times.
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AllMenAreIslands |
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James - OTTP2: He fits the "gentle giant" billing to a tee. Finally a black man gets a sympathetic edit. It's difficult to give someone with so little screen time this rating, but I agree with AMAI that it occasionally fits. He was just such a one-dimensional "root for him, please!" edit.Thanks, forweg! That's an excellent use of ratings. I think you're absolutely right. He was extremely positive in his screentime, even though there wasn't a whole lot of it. Edgic always makes for interesting reading. I'll be around. (Hi flf!!! Great job organizing this.) |
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colleenlover |
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Okay, only ONE real event happened at the ceremony -Leslie left it sometime in the process -she stepped outside. It happened. There was a ceremony and a woman
named Leslie stepped outside before it was over. Those are facts and it was documented.
Now we ask ourselves, how long was the ceremony? 15 mins? One hour? Three hours? I'm guessing it was made to go on longer than expected purposely to get some rises out of people. Did anyone else step outside or take a break? Did Jeff address them also and it was cut out? Did they have to show Leslie's response to Jeff instead of the nail in the coffin gong over her closeup after Jeff has spoked? It was hot and it was long, and it looked like the monks were probably showing the proper way for the players to do the movements, but we're shown Courtney's. Were there other people they could have shown correcting and made to look disrespectful? I found Aaron to be a layered edit because we our shown what he is thinking in terms of not being a leader way before it is thrusted upon him. So when Todd does his move, Aaorn is not an objective that Todd conquers, but someone we already understand with his mindset -we go, "uh oh" for Aaron. And how could I forget The Art of War was included!! And it showed red team going over it -this will be the team with power? Todd is nicely setup as the power player- either the long term master or dominates the first half before the merge. But he did get his quote about doing anything for a million dollars -most likely he's the long term Richard, Brian, Fairplay winner or obsticle. |
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TheLurkerSpeaks |
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Aaron - MOR. His character was introduced as the reluctant leader, but it wasn't heavily developed yet - no real tone.
James - MORP. Introduced in a favorable way, but without heavy focus. Still, the scene with Leslie wouldn't normally have needed to be shown. Jean-Robert - CP. We definitely got an insight into how he's playing the game, but I didn't detect any tone. Personally, I think calling out someone on a perceived character trait is stupid this early on, but I don't think the editors wanted to paint a judgement on his strategy yet. Leslie - MOR. The decision to leave the ceremony was handled neutrally, leaving it for the audience to decide how they perceive it. James was the focus of their joint scene although that tended positive. Her character has been introduced without overdoing it, and she could well turn out to be the winner. Todd - CP. The scenes with Jean-Robert and setting up Aaron as the leader developed him pretty well. I would assume he'll be around for quite awhile, but I doubt he'll win. He just seems like a distraction waiting to happen. In any case, this tribe is more developed than the one below, and they didn't even go to tribal council. I would strongly suspect the winner is one of
those above, and right now I'd lean toward Leslie, then Aaron, then James. If Todd is toned down in the next few episodes, he could join them.
Dave - MOR. He voiced support for Chicken and was willing to take the leadership role. I think he was probably right to target weakness amongst the young, but other than that I know little about him. Erik - UTR. I'm not even sure who this is. Frosti - OTTP. He was presented as an underdog trying to prove himself. He had mixed results during the challenge, but none of his teammates seemed to call him out on it. Jaime - UTR. See Erik. Peih Gee - CPN. She, along with Frosti, was the most developed player on this team, but being called bossy and teary with evidence to back it up generally
is not good.
At this point, none of these seems likely to win. Peih Gee, Dave, and Frosti have the best odds from this group.
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astroline |
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Haven't been around yet, and won't be back until Sunday, but here are my initial ratings!
Aaron - MOR3 Amanda - UTR2 Courtney - MORN3 Denise - UTRP1 James - OTTP2 Jean-Robert - CP3 Leslie - MORM3 Todd - CP4 Ashley - CP4 Chicken - OTTN5 Dave - MOR4 Erik - UTR1 Frosti - MORP3 Jaime - UTR1 Peih Gee - CPM5 Sherea - UTR2 I have no winner picks yet. I think Todd is the strategic distraction. His edit was ALL about strategy, even when Jean-Robert asked about him being a flight attendant, it was only to set up that scene of...strategy. I just don't see him being the winner. Definitely some other interesting edits though - Ashley & Peih Gee stand out. Anyway, I'll be back on Sunday to catch up, do some final ratings & do my James WD report. Oh yeah, I loved the episode though!
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