2/25/09 Ep7 "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

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phantomkp		#161	[-]
Posts: 468 (02/26/09 6:38 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	cindidindi76 wrote: Maybe someone can enlighten me but why did Ben need to kill Locke once he heard of Eloise? Ducks We don't really know for sure. I'm sure there will be plenty of theories, though. Ok, here's mine :P I dont understand why some people here suddenly think Widmore is now the good guy and somehow Ben just got worse...nothing has changed? Anyone who believes Widmore wouldnt have tossed Locke aside (killed him) once they figured out how to get back to the island without him in the way...is fooling themselves. And why are people suddenly hating Ben more this episode than ever before? Didnt we already see Ben shoot Locke and dump him in a ditch with the decaying Dharmites? Ben nor Widmore have changed. They are both bad men, both untrustworthy, both going after their self interests. They BOTH tell Locke they agree he is the chosen one, but neither believes it. Dont you believe it. As for Ben killing Locke, Ben talked Locke down from suicide because he needed Lockes help/info. If Locke had died then, Ben would be screwed...never get back to the island. Ben "saved" Locke, and then Locke gave up 2 pieces of very valuable info...Jin was still alive and he had his ring, and that Eloise Hawkings could help get them back. Once Ben got those nuggets of surprising info...make no mistake, Ben was surprised by both...it was better for Ben to let Locke die then. Why? My guess is that Ben did not want Locke meeting Eloise Hawking...for whatever reason. Ben wants to be in control of the island, always been that way. Hes afraid of Widmore getting control back, and hes afraid of Locke getting it...always has been. I think Ben knew Locke was supposed to die and probably be awoken again on the Island...i think Ben knew this already cause he also knew Locke needed to get everyone together in order to get back to the island. Ben would know this includes Locke as well. I dont feel Ben killed Locke to make sure he never made it to the Island...i think he killed him cause he wanted to be the "leader" working with Eloise, not Locke. And im sure Ben's defense to Locke..in the upcoming episodes...is that "Locke, i only killed you because the Island told you, you were supposed to die...i knew you would be alive once we got back!" I dont buy Ben wanting to save Locke from commiting the "sin" of suicide cause it might prohibit his ascendence to leader of the Island...Ben could give a crap about what happens to Locke ultimately. Ben id just using him to get back, and get back into control of the island. Ben would much rather have Locke be a fallen leader anyways.
phantomkp		#162	[-]
Posts: 469 (02/26/09 6:46 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	PoChop wrote: It seemed to me that Ben killed Locke after he got the important information (about Ms. Hawking) he needed to get back to the island, and that he wanted Locke dead so there wouldn't be any competition for leader of the island once he got there. When he finally got around to talking to Ms. Hawking she's probably the one who told him that Locke needed to go back to the island even though he was dead. Ben may or may not have known at this point that Locke might come back to life on the island. Thats a good theory too...but before Ben killed Locke, he already knew that they all had to be together to find the island again...so wouldnt he know that he needed Locke, too? Unless you are saying Ben wouldnt have any clue that the Island would bring Locke back to life, thus Ben thought killing him would get Locke out of the way, and the dead body would be enough to have them all together? If that were true, wouldnt Ben's first instict be to kill all the 06 and drag their bodies on the plane cause that would work too? Im thinking Ben knew that Locke had to be with him, and i also believe Ben knows that Locke needs to be on the island, alive...for whatever ever reason. I think both Ben and Widmore knew this, as much as Alpert knew it...i think they all three know Locke has to be back there, alive, to do something to save the island...but according to Widmore and Ben, after that is expendible. And im betting Widmore and Ben also knew Locke had to die before going back, just like Alpert knew. (for anyone doubting that Widmore could know so much about what needs to happen...Abbadon was working for Widmore, right? Abbadon's job pre-season 1 was to help make sure these people got onto 815 in the first place, right? Which would mean Widmore knows alot about whats supposed to happen...even though he hasnt been on the Island for a long time...right?)
phantomkp		#163	[-]
Posts: 470 (02/26/09 6:50 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	PumaPeggy wrote: I'm fairly certain Locke is not on the big island so to speak....but on the small island where Kate, Jack and Sawyer were held for awhile. I think Lapidus spotted the runway that was being built and got the plane set down there. Thats what i thought too...the Dharma station certainly resembled that area. But the only thing that bothers me about that...is that Kate, Sawyer, Locke, Faraday...when skipping around in time, came upon the 316's campsite..saw the water bottles, outriggers, and everything. And we know that they only skip in time, not location...they always end up in the same location, different time, right? So how could they end up on the small island if theyve always been on the big one? The only explanation may be that what Kate, Sawyer, Locke, Faraday came upon was a second 316 campsite..after the 316 used the outriggers to get to the big island??
Fusili Jerri		#164	[-]
Posts: 317 (02/26/09 7:35 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Fluffynurse wrote: kdo2 wrote: Megkris72 wrote: I think Ben killed Locke to prevent him from committing suicide, which is a mortal sin, and he wouldn't be able to be resurected if he committed suicide. There is a lot of religious doctorine in LOST and it would stand to reason that suicide would mean that our man of faith couldn't be shown to have lost all faith. Interesting theory on the suicide/sin thing. Nah, that's not it. Christian Sheppard committed suicide in his hotel room. He was brought back to life on the island. Are we sure that he actually did kill himself - or did he have help from Mr. Linus????? Last Edited By: Fusili Jerri 02/26/09 7:39 AM. Edited 1 times.
yorlik		#165	[-]
Posts: 323 (02/26/09 8:04 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just thinking outloud about Widmore. We know that he knows where Eloise is and he may still be in good terms with her. Eloise can tell him when the island can be reachable. She probably did it for the freighter. If he wants to go back to the island so badly, why doesn't he just ask Eloise and be on plane or freighter? Why send people rather to go by himself? He seems to want a clean island before going but why help John go back with the O6? And why Eloise didn't tell Widmore that Ben is going back too. With all the surveillance and connection, Widmore must know that Ben is going back. Last Edited By: yorlik 02/26/09 8:26 AM. Edited 1 times.
Tigernanama		#166	[-]
Posts: 659 (02/26/09 8:40 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	If they skip around in time but not location, did the O6 fall out of the sky, then? Thank god for that lagoon, but what about Sun and Sayid? Sux for them if they appeared over stone.
pleasepassthepork		#167	[-]
Posts: 413 (02/26/09 8:53 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Has anyone had the tar beat of them as much as Ben? Dude should have some long-term brain damage by now!
flashcal	Locke	#168	[-]
Posts: 112 (02/26/09 8:53 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	"Ben nor Widmore have changed. They are both bad men, both untrustworthy, both going after their self interests. They BOTH tell Locke they agree he is the chosen one, but neither believes it. Dont you believe it. " Someone said don't believe Locke is the chosen one. He was just resurrected from the Dead. And nobody's even talking about it. He was dead. Now he's alive. That a pretty big plot point. Isn't that interesting to anyone? I knew he'd be back in some way but I thought he'd be a phantom like Christian. Not full blown alive. Jack's gonna freak.
lynys		#169	[-]
Posts: 23 (02/26/09 8:58 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Do you know for sure that Christian is a phantom? He may very well be alive.
aslanscubs		#170	[-]
Posts: 2054 (02/26/09 9:08 AM) MWV Champ and I get pecan pie! Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Was it stated that Lapidus took off in one of the canoes with a woman (Sun?), or just with another passenger? (And I wonder WHY they took off.) They said it was the pilot (Frank) and a woman who I just assumed was Sun because it would make sense that Sun would want to go right away to try to find Jin. This episode was awesome but the scene with Ben killing Locke made my jaw drop. For those of you who think us spoiler people are getting a lot of spoilers this season, think again. We had no clue as to what would happen between Ben and Locke. Wow, I haven't been shocked about LOST like that in a long time!
FeliciaM7		#171	[-]
Posts: 6867 (02/26/09 9:22 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	What she said. Spoilers readers didn't know that. It made my stomach queasy. I felt so sorry for Locke in this episode. Oh now we have a few more people on the CSIA bandwagon? The poster who said Christian died of alcohol poisoning is right. No way of knowing if he intentionally drank himself dead. I'd be inclined to think no. If you wanna die, that's a nasty way to kill yourself. Hang yourself with a cord like Locke intended to do!
ErgotOgre		#172	[-]
Posts: 46 (02/26/09 9:26 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	As soon as Locke stepped down from the chair and sat down I had a feeling Ben was going to take matters into his own hands. The emotion on his face as he did the dastardly deed was unexpected, though. I don't know what to make of Ben and Widmore. I go back and forth between being amused and frustrated at the way the writers play with us about them and their motives. I'm always amused when they have a character voice or react to something the same way the audience does though. Locke was just as confused about what to believe last night as I was. It reminded me of the look he had on his face when Ben was piling metallic objects in the chamber at the Orchid station after he'd just watched the video saying keep metallic objects away. (No matter how many times I think of those few seconds of that episode, it makes me laugh.) I think we won't know until the end - if then! - whether Ben or Widmore is "the bad guy." They may both be bad; they may both be good. It may end up that there will be valid arguments for both. It was good to get more information about Widmore's stay on the island though, and interesting that he said a "war" is coming. That explains his intensity when he told Desmond to keep Penny away from the island; he knows that no matter how bad things are, and have been, they're going to get worse. So, he tells John he last saw him when he was seventeen years old and that he spent the next three decades on the island, which means he was in his late 40's when he left. Penny's how old? Mid- to late twenties? Early thirities? Which makes it likely that she was at least conceived on the island, if not born there. It's been a very long time since I've watched Desmond's early episodes. I need to go do some surfing to see what we've been told about his parentage. Why is he special? Why is Walt special? Why is John special? What does "special" mean in island lingo? The nosebleeds on the island may have stopped, but there's a vein throbbing in my forehead and I'm reaching for a tissue. Anyone else wonder where Locke got his Eloise-like black cloak? He wasn't wearing it in the coffin when Jack put the shoes on his feet.
sir debb eaton hogg		#173	[-]
Posts: 395 (02/26/09 9:26 AM) I need a life Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I think Christian did drink himself to death, given the flashback scene we saw of him and Sawyer. Also, I don't think Abaddon is really dead since he and Alpert never appear to age.
El Bingo Gringo		#174	[-]
Posts: 1934 (02/26/09 9:33 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Ben can NEVER return, yet now he returns. ACK!!! I'm this close (holds up thumb and pointer almost touching) to giving up LOST.
FeliciaM7		#175	[-]
Posts: 6870 (02/26/09 9:33 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I remember the scene. Drinking yourself nine-eyed batshit drunk isn't the same as drinking til you die. I'm sure Christian drank til he dropped many times in his past. It finally caught up with him and killed him.
PoChop		#176	[-]
Posts: 1883 (02/26/09 9:49 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Christian doesn't appear to be alive in the same sense as Locke. He appears to be more of an apparition like some of the 815ers who've kicked the bucket yet appear to other folks once in a while. Locke does seem special in this sense. Or is it that Christian and the other dead people are alive in an alternate dimension or reality? And that these dimensions are now intersecting because of the island? There's still the question as to whether Patchy actually died multiple times, or if we're seeing multiple Patchys from multiple dimensions, and he always seemed real enough and never like an apparition as far as I remember. Patchy and that Other lady didn't seem too concerned about kicking the bucket. What's up with that?
yorlik		#177	[-]
Posts: 324 (02/26/09 10:32 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Anyone else wonder where Locke got his Eloise-like black cloak? He wasn't wearing it in the coffin when Jack put the shoes on his feet. As much as we want every details to have a significance, I think this one was just to have some suspense as who the hooded person was.
pussycow		#178	[-]
Posts: 4399 (02/26/09 10:39 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	yorlik wrote: Anyone else wonder where Locke got his Eloise-like black cloak? He wasn't wearing it in the coffin when Jack put the shoes on his feet. As much as we want every details to have a significance, I think this one was just to have some suspense as who the hooded person was. I had to laugh at the build up and the "OH MY GOD I CAN'T BELIEVE IT'S LOCKE AND HE'S ALIVE!" dramatic music after they had showed that scene in the previews. It's not like we all didn't know who it was.
Hostile6		#179	[-]
Posts: 971 (02/26/09 10:41 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	yorlik wrote: Anyone else wonder where Locke got his Eloise-like black cloak? He wasn't wearing it in the coffin when Jack put the shoes on his feet. As much as we want every details to have a significance, I think this one was just to have some suspense as who the hooded person was. It is from the plane. It has the airline symbol on it.
alexineruby		#180	[-]
Posts: 3695 (02/26/09 11:15 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I would have to say the most obvious "x file" here is what the USA is to make of the odds of the Oceanic 6 being aboard another plane crashing into the same area they did 3-some years ago. Wouldn't a huge red flag come up over that?? (the ones traveling under their own names of course)

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2/25/09 Ep7 "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

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