S-17 Edgic (editing and logic) Gabon

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getting real		#3601	[-]
Posts: 1395 (11/29/08 5:40 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Phoenix said: Anyway.. 7n's and GR's posts are everything i wanted to say about matty. I have felt for some time now that the THEME of this game is a much larger character than previous seasons. For a player to be linked to the theme the way Matty has is a huge editing choice that cannot be overlooked. The only other comparisons that i can think of that are similar (although maybe not as large in scope) are Todd (Art of War) and Yul (racial division commentary).... especially Yul. Even though I was fanning on Ozzy, i knew that Yul's edit was better simply because he had comments about the racial division, he had personal stories from childhood about how racism personally affected him, etc.... Very good point about themes sometimes having a more significant role in some seasons than others, Phoenix. You could tell from the start that this was going to be one of those seasons. Interestingly, (and someone will probably correct me here) I think the personal childhood reactions from Yul only came in the recap episode. All the more reason to pay attention to this recap and its emboldened editorializing. The way they've set up beat us up over the head about this season, it will be a huge disappointment for the audience if one of Matty, Sugar and Bob doesn't win. We know that Bob doesn't, we know that Sugar probably doesn't, so Matty it is.
tropical rain		#3602	[-]
Posts: 329 (11/29/08 5:57 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Anyway.. 7n's and GR's posts are everything i wanted to say about matty. I have felt for some time now that the THEME of this game is a much larger character than previous seasons. For a player to be linked to the theme the way Matty has is a huge editing choice that cannot be overlooked. The only other comparisons that i can think of that are similar (although maybe not as large in scope) are Todd (Art of War) and Yul (racial division commentary).... especially Yul. Even though I was fanning on Ozzy, i knew that Yul's edit was better simply because he had comments about the racial division, he had personal stories from childhood about how racism personally affected him, etc.... I agree. Along with some people, I've been saying Matty has won ever since Marcus has been gone... With Ken second. We'll see, I think they're both in really good spots and it's a tough call this year.
OnlyTheHunter		#3603	[-]
Posts: 1870 (11/29/08 6:15 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	gr said The way they've set up beat us up over the head about this season, it will be a huge disappointment for the audience if one of Matty, Sugar and Bob doesn't win. We know that Bob doesn't, we know that Sugar probably doesn't, so Matty it is. Nope. Maybe your feelings were different, but my example is the EI season. You had Terry or Cirie set up to please a significant portion of the audience, and I was diappointed with Danielle and (gag) Aras. That's why flf posted exacted the same way I feel - Kenny sits as the winner, Sugar's loss is coming into view, and Crystal / Susie sits there. Matty is going fifth, the same time Sugar plays her idol. I've speculated that since Matty said it, and until I get proven wrong, it still makes sense to me. I also want to think that Crystal wins the last IC but a Sugar/Crystal/Kenny (or Matty) would be the first time a F3 has 3 real players in it, as opposed to a Susie. I'm sticking with Kenny. A Kenny or Matty win is backed up by Edgic, my take is that Kenny makes more sense. Anyone not seeing his usage in the recap ought to rewatch. Not that I put much stock in them, but the highlighted points for him were precisely the right ones to show. Michael
craig		#3604	[-]
Posts: 14388 (11/29/08 6:53 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	in terms of telling us what we're supposed to feel, I can't escape the feeling that they are doing this to make the end satisfying in regards to what the story is trying to sell about what/who is good or bad. I think the winner will be good (Matty) or maybe evil (Crystal, Corinne), not someone who doesn't fit into that matrix (Kenny). Cook Islands was the last time we were hit over the head with a good vs evil theme, and Aitu good guys were top 2. When a hardcore strategist wins the season is often edited as smart vs dumb. This season has been about strategic players being foiled by twists and non-rational players (Sugar). After Yul, Todd, and Parvati, doesn't we just expect a strategist will win? (not an Ethan type). I've downgraded Matty because of the Ozzy analogy for awhile, but he's been shown as strategizing more than Ozzy and he wasn't negative early on for throwing a challenge. More important, Kenny isn't Yul. No FLF, the fact that they saved material for the Recap that could have given Sugar a M doesn't mean she deserved or was intended to be M last episode. Also, I don't see Matty recognizing the superiority of Kota to Fang as bad for him. Editing says Fang sucks, and we should feel bad for good Matty being separated from his ep.3 alliance all alone on the dumbass tribe. If Sugar plays with her heart - she gives the win to Matty If Sugar succumbs to "evil" and plays hardcore - she gives the win to Crystal or Corrinne. She has both emotional and game reasons for booting Kenny before F3. The Recap concluded by saying it's about Good Matty vs Evil Corinne, with Sugar in the Middle.
JFRX		#3605	[-]
Posts: 70 (11/29/08 7:31 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Too all those looking to jump on the Matty bandwagon after watching the recap: If Matty had such a great winners edit in the recap episode, then why weren't these scenes edited into the actual show? If anything, the fact that Matty looks so good in the recap shows that the editors intentionally cut lots of his good stuff from the normal episodes and shoved it into the recap, implying that he is not actually the winner, and the editors simply used the opportunity of the recap to develop his character (because he wasn't very developed in the normal episodes). Kenny, on the other hand, didn't really get too much 'extra' attention in the recap that wasn't already seen on the actual show. This would seem to suggest that we've already seen most of Kenny's best scenes. Furthermore, the editorialising of what they did show (such as ignoring the Kenny-Charlie revenge subplot and simplifying Ken's decisions to show his journey from the stupid boy who picked Kelly to the grown man who united the underdogs) is exacly what we would expect for a winner. Kenny was such a standout in the merge episode, that most of Edgic didn't think he had enough doubt. However, surely being UTR in the Randy-Sugar episode and being underemphasised in the Recap so that we consider Crystal, Matty and Sugar as strong contenders for the win constitutes this doubt as we now approach the endgame, with only a few episodes to go.
colleenlover		#3606	[-]
Posts: 8836 (11/29/08 7:40 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Crystal is not played as evil -just trying to pull through. You have to rewatch -she gets the sympathetic music all the way. The recaps haven't been trashing Fang -just setting them up as people who can't get their act together -Probst even has an inserted voiceover when Ace foils thier close immunity win before Kelly goes -"And if you continue to act as individuals..." is a complete insert most likely added in post production. I don't know if I'm on the Matty bandwagon -and it certainly wouldn't be based solely on the recap. yes, Kenny has a lot of material -but to me the only manipulated story character moments are the termite scene and the stuck boat scene. The rest seem more based on his actual shaping of the game. Matty has added almost nothing to the game yet has been given so much weight.
Phoenix1269		#3607	[-]
Posts: 327 (11/29/08 7:50 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	JFRX wrote: Too all those looking to jump on the Matty bandwagon after watching the recap: If Matty had such a great winners edit in the recap episode, then why weren't these scenes edited into the actual show? If anything, the fact that Matty looks so good in the recap shows that the editors intentionally cut lots of his good stuff from the normal episodes and shoved it into the recap, implying that he is not actually the winner, and the editors simply used the opportunity of the recap to develop his character (because he wasn't very developed in the normal episodes). Kenny, on the other hand, didn't really get too much 'extra' attention in the recap that wasn't already seen on the actual show. This would seem to suggest that we've already seen most of Kenny's best scenes. Furthermore, the editorialising of what they did show (such as ignoring the Kenny-Charlie revenge subplot and simplifying Ken's decisions to show his journey from the stupid boy who picked Kelly to the grown man who united the underdogs) is exacly what we would expect for a winner. Kenny was such a standout in the merge episode, that most of Edgic didn't think he had enough doubt. However, surely being UTR in the Randy-Sugar episode and being underemphasised in the Recap so that we consider Crystal, Matty and Sugar as strong contenders for the win constitutes this doubt as we now approach the endgame, with only a few episodes to go. the only extra scenes from Matty were the leeches scene and the singing to his girlfriend (excluding the video application hoo haa). Everything else featuring Matty was a repeat. The difference between Ken and Matty... is that Matty's whole journey was summarized for us, with some extra meat, where Ken's was basically... barely a just the facts, ma'am.
SFC		#3608	[-]
Posts: 502 (11/29/08 8:18 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I was looking at the old Fiji Edgic thread and saw a post by FLF and it was one of the picture recaps, however these pictures were somehow replaced with ones from Gabon, and if you read the text with some of the new pictures quite a few of of them actually still make sense. http://survivorsucks.yuku...c-editing-and-logic-.html
ncassaro		#3609	[-]
Posts: 356 (11/29/08 10:37 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	SFC wrote: I was looking at the old Fiji Edgic thread and saw a post by FLF and it was one of the picture recaps, however these pictures were somehow replaced with ones from Gabon, and if you read the text with some of the new pictures quite a few of of them actually still make sense. http://survivorsucks.yuku...c-editing-and-logic-.html ROFLMAO! God, Dreamz sucked. Thank God GC didn't make it to F3.
ncassaro		#3610	[-]
Posts: 357 (11/29/08 10:53 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	colleenlover wrote: Crystal is not played as evil -just trying to pull through. You have to rewatch -she gets the sympathetic music all the way. The recaps haven't been trashing Fang -just setting them up as people who can't get their act together -Probst even has an inserted voiceover when Ace foils thier close immunity win before Kelly goes -"And if you continue to act as individuals..." is a complete insert most likely added in post production. I don't know if I'm on the Matty bandwagon -and it certainly wouldn't be based solely on the recap. yes, Kenny has a lot of material -but to me the only manipulated story character moments are the termite scene and the stuck boat scene. The rest seem more based on his actual shaping of the game. Matty has added almost nothing to the game yet has been given so much weight. I dunno whether to agree or disagree here. Crystal in the Ace/Dan boot episode was a resounding N. It seemed that she had given up and was the new GC. Since then, she had a great CP in the Marcus boot episode and has been mostly UTR since then. It's a bizarre edit..... and I just dunno what the intention behind it is.
colleenlover		#3611	[-]
Posts: 8837 (11/29/08 11:05 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I just rewatched this one -she wasn't negative. She did bad things in real life that was reported in which you the viewer are led to make your decision. The comments on her were based on the reality of the situation that could not be avoided- ie. Matty being fed up. And editing had an insert about complexity from Crystal concerned she would be perceived as GC and she doesn't ever want to be a quitter. To me, a manipulation in negative or positive is based on inserted shots, music cues- Kelly in the hammock is a perfect example, jerri hammering the stake in outback, Lis's praise of Rodger with flowery music, Rupert dreaming about his wife. With Crystal she did these things, they were unavoidable issues -the vote, the discussion in TC; tweaking of reporting, not an agenda for tone. Does that make sense? She's being crafted for certain, but the agenda isn't caught up in the positive or the negative -more about her suffering, her struggles and no one getting anything past her -"you can't outwit Crystal Cox, baby." I don't think we'll be seeing the stage set up for a bad guy with her -I think that will fall more on Kenny once Corrine leaves.
ncassaro		#3612	[-]
Posts: 358 (11/29/08 11:30 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Of course.... when it comes to edgic, we're not talking about Crystal the person, we're talking about Crystal the edit. And I have said before that if Crystal was our winner, there is no way they could cut her OTTness and give her a Marcus-type edit because the show would lose a lot of its entertainment value... love her or hate her, Crystal has been highly entertaining. So there are some things that simply happened and the editors can't just cut out. IMO, spilling the rice and the ensuing debate at tribal was optional. It wasn't critical to the story. So either Crystal was just being edited with a hard, almost GC-like N or it was a distraction to the Ace boot. I knew I personally thought Crystal was a goner. I dunno. Weird season. But awesome season.
Francois40		#3613	[-]
Posts: 2639 (11/29/08 11:41 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just watched the whole recap and noted that it showed Corrine's little "I want to KILL Sugar, I HATE her!" speech once, twice, three times. This is definitely a jury rivalry a la Jean-Robert and Courtney being set up.
chapera rocks		#3614	[-]
Posts: 9909 (11/29/08 11:48 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	colleenlover wrote: I just rewatched this one -she wasn't negative. She did bad things in real life that was reported in which you the viewer are led to make your decision. The comments on her were based on the reality of the situation that could not be avoided- ie. Matty being fed up. And editing had an insert about complexity from Crystal concerned she would be perceived as GC and she doesn't ever want to be a quitter. To me, a manipulation in negative or positive is based on inserted shots, music cues- Kelly in the hammock is a perfect example, jerri hammering the stake in outback, Lis's praise of Rodger with flowery music, Rupert dreaming about his wife. With Crystal she did these things, they were unavoidable issues -the vote, the discussion in TC; tweaking of reporting, not an agenda for tone. Does that make sense? She's being crafted for certain, but the agenda isn't caught up in the positive or the negative -more about her suffering, her struggles and no one getting anything past her -"you can't outwit Crystal Cox, baby." I don't think we'll be seeing the stage set up for a bad guy with her -I think that will fall more on Kenny once Corrine leaves. I agree 100%. Crystal has gotten way too many negatives the this season. Especially the last two episodes. I would even argue Sugar wasn't negative this past episode. She came across like a bitch... yes. But she wasn't EDITED as one. That wasn't their intent. We were supposed to be laughing with her. The editors wanted us to think she was the hero who slaughtered the troll. They downplayed the fact that it was an unnecessary move Just my opinion though.
AllMenAreIslands		#3615	[-]
Posts: 25828 (11/30/08 1:00 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just saw an ad on TV: "How will Sugar cope being stuck between good (Matty, coming across a tad argumentative) and evil (Corrine bitching that she never tried to buy Sugar's vote)?" I don't know what to make of it, in terms of why these three are being mentioned in the ads? Is it because they or two of them anyway, are in the F3?
SurvivorFanGP		#3616	[-]
Posts: 9589 (11/30/08 3:20 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Matty's the driving force behind targetting Corinne, Corinne targets Matty, Sugar has to choose a side? (Can get a good idea of that outcome, eh? )
crzypunk2004		#3617	[-]
Posts: 3853 (11/30/08 10:47 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I agree that Crystal has been getting Ns when she shouldn't be getting any Ns. Especially the last 2 episodes, and lets say Crystal is our winner. If you take out her tc outbursts has she really been that negative?. I doubt the editors will take out her tc outbursts if she were the winner, because they've been entertaining.
wallduck		#3618	[-]
Posts: 471 (11/30/08 2:32 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just watched the whole recap and noted that it showed Corrine's little "I want to KILL Sugar, I HATE her!" speech once, twice, three times. This is definitely a jury rivalry a la Jean-Robert and Courtney being set up. Maybe, but not limited to the jury. The intensity of those repeated scenes suggests a climax sooner rather than later. We focus so much on the final climax that it's easy to forget that there needs to be a climax in each episode. To keep viewers watching there has to be short-term tension, not just the promise of long-term fireworks. I take the recap's focus on Sugar, Corrine, and Matty as a signal that one of them is going soon--and probably more than one of them. Maybe it's no more complicated than Sugar joining Matty et al to vote out Corinne, but that wouldn't be particularly dramatic since it's already clear that Corinne is almost without allies. A twist is more likely. And the hypervisibility lately of Sugar and Matty is bad, not good, for their chances.
ncassaro		#3619	[-]
Posts: 359 (11/30/08 2:46 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	OnlyTheHunter wrote: gr said The way they've set up beat us up over the head about this season, it will be a huge disappointment for the audience if one of Matty, Sugar and Bob doesn't win. We know that Bob doesn't, we know that Sugar probably doesn't, so Matty it is. From the looks of the promos though, next week's episode should be Bob's "coming out party." Natalie and Danni both had them around this time. I wouldn't be surprised to see him at least make the final 4.
cindidindi76		#3620	[-]
Posts: 13658 (11/30/08 4:03 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I haven't seen any promos yet, since Buffalo was Fox this weekend, but something tells me Bobs "coming out" won't be quite like Natalies, lol.

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S-17 Edgic (editing and logic) Gabon

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