4/24/08 Ep9 "The Shape of Things to Come" - Lost - Other Shows that aren't Survivor - Survivor Sucks - Message Board - Yuku

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4/24/08 Ep9 "The Shape of Things to Come"

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WiscBadger95		#201	[-]
Posts: 11044 (04/25/08 12:21 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	aslanscubs wrote: You're welcome, Sera. The new logo might be the one belonging to the Orchid Station which was introduced to Lost fans this past summer via video at Comic Con. Could be, since it does look something like an orchid ...
chidelta	Ben bends time	#202	[-]
Posts: 1076 (04/25/08 1:23 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Picking up on something WiscBadger said (nice orchid, by the way): He also seemed to me to be a bit disoriented, like he wasn't expecting to be in the Tunisian desert. I found this interesting as well, along with the rip in his parka and the cut on his arm. And, immediately following his Rambo moves in the desert, he confirmed the date with the hotel clerk. To me, it seemed like he intended to be at that place, at that time, but was a little shocked that it worked and needed to be sure. But I still wondered when he left the island (or some cold place) to arrive in the Sahara. Could this have been the first time he traveled in time? Or did he really travel in time? I see three general possibilities: 1) Ben left the island to time travel in 2004 or early 2005, some time after the Oceanic 6 have left or have been allowed (maybe by Ben) to leave. This would mean that he had to have foreseen Sayid's marriage and Nadia's death, so this option is unlikely. To the extent that those who flash forward and back and sideways in time do so by taking the wrong path off the island and losing their constant, this scenario would also be quite risky. (Or who knows, maybe he really does have a magic box).; 2) Ben is coming from some future date, after Nadia's death, in order to intercept Sayid and bring him into his ongoing global battle with Widmore. (Insert standard arguments against going back in time to alter the future, ripples in time, time-space continuum, etc.).; or 3) Ben didn't really travel in time, just in space, and he left the island (or wherever he was) at about the same time he arrived in the desert. In this scenario, Ben has been tracking the Oceanic 6 for almost a year, and has waited patiently until the right moment to have Nadia killed, set up the bald guy who has been tailing Sayid (on Widmore's behalf), and then makes a move to manipulate Sayid into becoming the island's hired assassin. He could only do this in person, so he jumped into the sideways transmogrifier and went for a little thrill ride. I'm going with door number 3 (at least for now).
PagongSchlong		#203	[-]
Posts: 2721 (04/25/08 1:33 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	chidelta wrote: Picking up on something WiscBadger said (nice orchid, by the way): He also seemed to me to be a bit disoriented, like he wasn't expecting to be in the Tunisian desert. I found this interesting as well, along with the rip in his parka and the cut on his arm. And, immediately following his Rambo moves in the desert, he confirmed the date with the hotel clerk. To me, it seemed like he intended to be at that place, at that time, but was a little shocked that it worked and needed to be sure. But I still wondered when he left the island (or some cold place) to arrive in the Sahara. Could this have been the first time he traveled in time? Or did he really travel in time? I see three general possibilities: 1) Ben left the island to time travel in 2004 or early 2005, some time after the Oceanic 6 have left or have been allowed (maybe by Ben) to leave. This would mean that he had to have foreseen Sayid's marriage and Nadia's death, so this option is unlikely. To the extent that those who flash forward and back and sideways in time do so by taking the wrong path off the island and losing their constant, this scenario would also be quite risky. (Or who knows, maybe he really does have a magic box).; 2) Ben is coming from some future date, after Nadia's death, in order to intercept Sayid and bring him into his ongoing global battle with Widmore. (Insert standard arguments against going back in time to alter the future, ripples in time, time-space continuum, etc.).; or 3) Ben didn't really travel in time, just in space, and he left the island (or wherever he was) at about the same time he arrived in the desert. In this scenario, Ben has been tracking the Oceanic 6 for almost a year, and has waited patiently until the right moment to have Nadia killed, set up the bald guy who has been tailing Sayid (on Widmore's behalf), and then makes a move to manipulate Sayid into becoming the island's hired assassin. He could only do this in person, so he jumped into the sideways transmogrifier and went for a little thrill ride. I'm going with door number 3 (at least for now). So, in essence, you think Ben is a jumper...or at least has something that provides him the ability to "jump". I want to be a jumper. That would be kick ass.
chidelta	Jumping bean	#204	[-]
Posts: 1077 (04/25/08 1:38 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Yeah, I guess that's right, Pagong. I suppose that it would make more sense if he and Tom and company had the ability to jump off the island previously, and were using it all along, maybe even to go out for tacos or deep dish pizza something. But his surprise upon arrival made me think it was either a first time thing, or just the first time from a new (and colder) location. Like Antartica, or Brazil, by way of Australia (the key to everything).
PagongSchlong		#205	[-]
Posts: 2723 (04/25/08 1:46 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Ooooh. This made me think of something else! When Ben ended up in Tunisia, he yacked shortly after arrival. Remember when Alpert and Ethan recruited Juliet, they told her the trip could be unsettling (or something like that) and gave her a sedative. That brings me to the conclusion the submarine didn't do jack shit after all. Just like Ben told Locke, it maintains the illusion that folks can come and go. Alpert and Ethan probably just put Juliet in there so that when she woke up, she'd assume they got there via sub.
PumaPeggy		#206	[-]
Posts: 1191 (04/25/08 1:47 PM) I don't get most of the jokes Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	chidelta wrote: Yeah, I guess that's right, Pagong. I suppose that it would make more sense if he and Tom and company had the ability to jump off the island previously, and were using it all along, maybe even to go out for tacos or deep dish pizza something. But his surprise upon arrival made me think it was either a first time thing, or just the first time from a new (and colder) location. Like Antartica, or Brazil, by way of Australia (the key to everything). it DID seem as if wherever Ben started from was not the norm for him. Interesting how he seemed to have come from a very cold spot wearing a Dharma parka to the same place Charlotte found the polar bear (which normally belongs in a cold spot) wearing the Dharma collar...Tunisia.
Screerider		#207	[-]
Posts: 21482 (04/25/08 1:48 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I think the Orchid station takes the quantum principle of wave-particle duality to the non-quantum level. As a wave, a particle becomes a blob of probabilities. When measured, the wave collapses into some spot within that blob, based on those probabilities. This behavior explains "quantum tunnelling", where particles pass through solid barriers, simply because a part of their probability cloud extends through the barrier, enabling them to jump to the other side a percentage of the time. So, bringing in the science fiction, you turn a human into a probabilty cloud, he could collapse some distance away, depending on the size of the cloud. Presumably, they're focusing the collapse around some destination point, allowing some form of directed travel, with just a dash of variance at the arrival location. But there's always that 0.000000x% chance of collapsing way off the mark. Perhaps focusing of the wave function ends up adding a variance in the time property as well, with similar 0.000000x% chances of ending up at a time way off the mark. Which is why it's always good to confirm the year of arrival.
PumaPeggy		#208	[-]
Posts: 1192 (04/25/08 1:50 PM) I don't get most of the jokes Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	>>by way of Australia (the key to everything). << Widmore, spoke with an Australian accent to Ben...not his normal English accent.
Sardonically Irreverent		#209	[-]
Posts: 12807 (04/25/08 1:51 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Oh duh! I just got it. Some curious little polar bear on the island wandered into the "magic box' somehow and got its ass zapped to Tunisia. That's how the polar bear ended up in the desert.
PagongSchlong		#210	[-]
Posts: 2724 (04/25/08 1:53 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Screerider wrote: I think the Orchid station takes the quantum principle of wave-particle duality to the non-quantum level. As a wave, a particle becomes a blob of probabilities. When measured, the wave collapses into some spot within that blob, based on those probabilities. This behavior explains "quantum tunnelling", where particles pass through solid barriers, simply because a part of their probability cloud extends through the barrier, enabling them to jump to the other side a percentage of the time. So, bringing in the science fiction, you turn a human into a probabilty cloud, he could collapse some distance away, depending on the size of the cloud. Presumably, they're focusing the collapse around some destination point, allowing some form of directed travel, with just a dash of variance at the arrival location. But there's always that 0.000000x% chance of collapsing way off the mark. Perhaps focusing of the wave function ends up adding a variance in the time property as well, with similar 0.000000x% chances of ending up at a time way off the mark. Which is why it's always good to confirm the year of arrival. While I certainly appreciate the fact that your brain is clearly much better than mine, I thank God you don't write for LOST. I probably wouldn't have made it past the Pilot episode. ;)
WiscBadger95		#211	[-]
Posts: 11047 (04/25/08 2:00 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	My take is that it's some sort of "jumping" device, but the reason Ben seemed surprised to end up where he did is because now it's not working quite right. Maybe Miles f-ed it up trying to use it, or it got damaged somehow during the war with the freighters. I'll bet that it used to work just fine and they could go to exactly where they wanted to go. In fact, I'll bet that's how they really brought Juliet to the island. Remember that they doped her up because the ride can be a little rough, as Ethan put it. Maybe they doped her up because they didn't want her to know how she really got there.
PagongSchlong		#212	[-]
Posts: 2727 (04/25/08 2:01 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Badger, did you read post #205 on this page? ;)
Screerider		#213	[-]
Posts: 21484 (04/25/08 2:05 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	While I certainly appreciate the fact that your brain is clearly much better than mine, I thank God you don't write for LOST. I probably wouldn't have made it past the Pilot episode. Don't worry. They wouldn't bother explaining it that much, just referring to "Quantum Physics taken to the next level" when asked how it works. That's all. I have no idea how this station would work on getting things to the Island. Like Juliet. Or how Ben would get back. Something like a wristband with some sort of homing beacon, I'd guess, so the station could "lock on" to the signal and swoop up whatever's in the vacinity.
WiscBadger95		#214	[-]
Posts: 11048 (04/25/08 2:05 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	PagongSchlong wrote: Badger, did you read post #205 on this page? ;) Not until after I posted.
PagongSchlong		#215	[-]
Posts: 2728 (04/25/08 2:08 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite
PoChop		#216	[-]
Posts: 1490 (04/25/08 2:12 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Yeah, it's all about the Debroglie wavelength. There must be catacombs under the island where the dead from the foot civilization are buried. Perhaps they were originally hollow lava tubes that were reinforced by the natives to create the catacombs. It's possible the spirits of the dead ancestors can become ol' smokey if they become angry and need to save the island from danger. Or the Jinn spirits live underground and are released on command by folks who know the ancient ways. Dharma may have released them accidentally while doing construction work when they accidentally broke into the catacombs. Or maybe not. I was thinking that Ben had a few moments of disorientation post transport. And I doubt he wore a Parka in case he landed in a cold climate. Certainly that wouldn't have been enough to survive at the North pole very long, even if he found Superman's Ice Fortress. And it would be much more likely that he would appear by random chance in the ocean or in a bulkhead. So I figure the coat was being worm because it was cold where he came from. At least he didn't need to teleport through space and time naked like the poor folks in the Terminator movies do.
Mister Hooper		#217	[-]
Posts: 70 (04/25/08 2:16 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	yorlik wrote: Who has the most to gain to have Nadia killed? Widmore or Ben? I think it's obvious. And Ben "appearing" in Tunisia just after Nadia's murder is coincidence? I think not. Didn't Sayid say something about taking eight years to find her, then marrying her?
WiscBadger95		#218	[-]
Posts: 11050 (04/25/08 2:22 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Mister Hooper wrote: yorlik wrote: Who has the most to gain to have Nadia killed? Widmore or Ben? I think it's obvious. And Ben "appearing" in Tunisia just after Nadia's murder is coincidence? I think not. Didn't Sayid say something about taking eight years to find her, then marrying her? Yeah, he'd been looking for her ever since he helped her to escape.
pagonglover		#219	[-]
Posts: 3975 (04/25/08 2:26 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Evil episode.....:P
Mister Hooper		#220	[-]
Posts: 71 (04/25/08 2:44 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	WiscBadger95 wrote: Mister Hooper wrote: yorlik wrote: Who has the most to gain to have Nadia killed? Widmore or Ben? I think it's obvious. And Ben "appearing" in Tunisia just after Nadia's murder is coincidence? I think not. Didn't Sayid say something about taking eight years to find her, then marrying her? Yeah, he'd been looking for her ever since he helped her to escape. I must be missing some back story then, escaped from where?

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