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Phoenix1269 |
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me too. 100%
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Phoenix1269 |
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weird... double post
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AllMenAreIslands |
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I had to think for a moment just now to recall that Eliza wasn't the winner on both RC & IC. Remember too - the reaction shots that were shown when
Jeff told them about the Reward? The reaction of the Airai women - who did not actually get to enjoy that reward. Odd, wouldn't you say?
Lots of people who are part of the challenge aren't given facetime. It's not just focusing on a main player of that challenge. It's also about apportioning time to each segment of the challenge. You can show twice as much of one segment as of the other. More puzzle solving, or more piece retrieval. They showed people running out across the course to get over to the puzzle pieces. If you timed it, you might see Ozzy & Eliza both got more time than others on their respective tribes who also ran out and retrieved a piece (per round, not cumulative.) In order to really have data, and if we had like a government grant to do this, we could work out for each challenge in every season how much time was spent on each player, as well as on each segment of the challenge. Then we'd know whether the winner of the show routinely was given extra facetime over the season, and which other players routinely got more time. Which players seemed to never get cameo face shots... and so on. Thing is - in a season where we have so much drama on the tribe that's losing the ICs and the other tribe is losing players due to injury of one kind or another, the story itself is causing a different kind of edit. This is why it may be foolhardy to eliminate some people even at this stage, for one or another "usual" death blows. Those players who've been given links to game long themes MIGHT be winner-material, or they might just have been the lucky person chose to give voice to the themes of the season, but they're not really illustrating those themes. |
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colleenlover |
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Look, I'm just really looking to see who has a story here -beginning, middle and eventual end in winning -a journey. Yeah, it doesn't always happen
(Danni, Vecepia) but I'll take my chances.
Yeah, Eliza might not have had that opening confessional -but I don't want to let anything get by me, and don't want to fall victim to talking about that in later seasons (yeah, but Eliza won in s16 and she didn't have an opening confessional). Right now the beginning stories were with Parvati, Eliza, Ozzy and begrudingly Cirie -and have consistantly built on those stories. Someone like Jason has only dealt with in the moment events. Stories, and manipulation -that's all I'm looking at. And yikes! In two episodes Jonathan, Tracy AND Kathy left -all great characters I was hoping to see in the mid to end game. The challenges have been exciting, but the camp life is really turning into snore zone for me. |
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unduli clone |
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OMG. Lost an entirely huge post. I wanna cry. It had huge arguments for certain ratings. Alexis - UTR1 Eliza - UTR1 James - MORP2 Jason - UTR1 Kathy - CPP5 Natalie - UTR1 Parvati- UTR1 Amanda- MOR3 Ami - CP4 Cirie - MORN5 Erik - OTTP4 Ozzy - OTTN5 Tracy - MORN3 ELIMINATED Alexis, Amanda, Ami, Cirie, Erik, James, Jason, Ozzy, Natalie. WINNERS 01) Parvati 02) Eliza NOTES: - Jason had individual call-outs at the IC. Usually challenge footage doesn't apply, but his name was called out frequently enough since it had a very strong individual element (especially with him as a puzzle worker). He's UTR1. - Natalie had two sentences and prominent screentime as Kathy quit. Easily UTR1. - Eliza had a combination of the two above, and Kathy said it was nice getting to know her. - Cirie had snarky comments that straddled bitchy and funny, but the boat was clearly N and pushed her over the edge. - Erik had the OTT music and fun SPV. Very OTT, and had the editorial intent to be P. - Tracy had no personal complexity or development. Mostly just straight in-your-face screentime. She was shown as a sour puss with NSPV in the opening scene, seemed to give up while also selling out Ozzy and Erik. Definitely N taints with no P draw-back. I felt the intent was for us to want Ozzy to go home, but be satisfied with the sourpuss's ouster. |
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chaperone |
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Sorry, I haven't caught up on the reading, so if this has already been stated, forgive me...but MANIPULATION alert! In the scene with Cirie and Amanda on
the log talking about Ozzy being arrogant, it shows Ami walking up to the scene, but that's the ONLY part of the scene Ami is actually in! They show after
that Ami nodding, but she's alone in the shot, they cut back to Cirie/Amanda, show the left side of them...no Ami...then they show the right side of
them...no Ami. Why did they cut Ami into that scene?
Interesting. Could just be that Ami walked up to them and it was awkward to not have her in the scene...but they could've cut in a shot of her walking away to explain it...but instead they cut her sitting WITH them interacting with them. It's weird and interesting. Thoughts? |
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craig |
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"Just for the record, I'm Canadian (and Survivor is like a Top 2 show here) and I don't remember/think we have ever seen the sprint thing...
I think we need to look at the edit we're given. The sprint thing is not manipulated."
In Canada on Global last week there is a feature on Parvati's being a charity organizer, and her Knockouts for Girls was cited as "giving scholarships and boxing lessons to underprivileged girls." So in Canada she definitely should have beeen MORP for ep.6, lol. I'm not bothered by Parvati's edit the last 3 episodes. First, ep.6 was borderline MOR2. Second, her tribe is experiencing a perfect storm for low visibility. Doesn't go to TC 3 times in a row - check Players on her tribe quit 2 times in a row - check. This eats up Malakal time without much role for other players. Ep 7 other tribe wins RC - check. Additional time must be devoted to other tribe. Danni went to TC 4 times in the first 7 episodes, Parvati only twice. Parv is CP in the preview offering an alliance to Nat\Alexis. probably that move only becames possible with the departure of Jonathan\Kathy and the fact there is only one Fan lefton the other tribe. So Parv's strategic situation in ep.5-6 is rendered moot. And I doubt she spends a lot of time fretting in front of the camera like Eliza. Cirie and Ozzy's negativity the last two episodes is worse that Malakal's justifiably low visibility.With Cirie, it continues a trend from ep.4. |
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SurvivorLeo |
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chaperone wrote:
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guatemala fanfic |
EPISODE 7 RATINGS | ||
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Survivor: Micronesia - Episode 7 (Ratings Watchdog)
Here are my final ratings for Episode 7.
Airai Tribe
Alexis: UTR1
Alexis was once again largely ignored in the editing, but she did get a confessional. The way her edit has been going almost seems like a deliberate attempt to keep her away from getting an INV1. Anyway, her confessional was actually fairly significant to me in that she said that game still continues to go on for everyone else, even though Kathy left the game. It shows that Alexis is thinking about the game and she is very game-minded, even though we haven't really been seeing any of that on the show. I could be wrong, but I don't think her confessional was enough for her to earn a 2.
Eliza: UTR1
This is the first time that Eliza hasn't had a confessional, but she narrowly escapes INV1 as well for being prominent in both of the challenges (especially the Reward Challenge, where she was the caller). I believe that her challenge visibility was enough to keep her on the viewers' radar and it made her not be completely ignored.
James: MORP2
Once again, James had two confessionals in this episode: the first one talked about everyone complaining about the rain; he said that it couldn't have been any worse than what they had before and that they won't be on the island forever. The second confessional was about Kathy quitting the game. He said that she basically lost her motivation and you can't be upset with her or hold it against her. He has not been shown a lot this season at all, but I think that the way he was shown being sympathetic to Kathy was enough for him to earn a P.
Jason: INV1
This episode was definitely the final kiss of death for Jason. Going from OTT, as I rated him last episode, to INV1 in two consecutive episodes is just about the worst thing that you can do. And the fact that the Exile Island scene was not shown basically seals it for him as well. It's unfortunate because I still believe that he had a very strong Episode 1 edit and I wonder why they gave him so many confessionals about being a Fan and wanting to survive in the wild, etc. I think he'll be an important character in the end, but he won't win.
Kathy: OTTP5
Well, that was a surprise and it makes two episodes in a row where we've lost two castaways in each one. The mid-episode scenes at Airai were pretty much narrated entirely by Kathy as she described the circumstances leading up to her emotional breakdown. It's very interesting how her quitting was treated in a positive and sympathetic manner. Once again, I'll point out the sad music being used that was definitely meant to make the audience feel sorry for her and be understanding of her situation. Her edit seemed to be very one-sided; I can see how there might be some complexity with the turbulent emotions involved, but I just think that she had to be characterized and shown as very one-note. There's no question to me that she should be an OTTP5.
Natalie: INV1
Natalie did say a few noticeable sentences, but compared to Alexis, Eliza, and Parvati, who all earned UTR1s with me, Natalie is a step below them and I can't in good conscience give them all the same rating. Natalie was on the same level as Jason, so that makes them both INV1. If she does get INV1, that ties her up with Stacy Kimball as the most INV1s ever, and plenty of time to break that record if she sticks around.
Parvati: UTR1
One more episode like this and Parvati is going to have to drop on my Winner's list, but it looks like next week, she'll be shown more. This is three episodes in a row where she has hardly even been shown at all, aside from maybe a confessional here and there. I understand that her tribe has never lost or had to go to Tribal Council, but if she won, I would still expect her to get shown a little bit more. This is about the time when she disappeared in Cook Islands too, which I think is interesting. Perhaps she falls short in the end like last time. Anyway, she got a confessional talking about Kathy's departure, which *is* a good thing for her to talk about, in my opinion, since it was the most significant thing that happened on Airai this week.
Malakal Tribe
Amanda: MOR3
For some reason, these MOR3s she's been getting seem really inflated for the amount of content in her edit, but alas, I will give her a MOR3 this week (compared to an UTR2 for the last episode). I agree that she was more developed in terms of strategy in this episode, and we saw more of her than usual (speaking of visibility, and the Reward), so I guess this rating does work. Her confessional was about not knowing whether or not she should turn on Ozzy; she said that if she wanted Ozzy gone, he would go and that it's inevitable that you'll hurt someone's feeling. We also saw her talking a bit with Cirie about possibly voting out Erik. She then didn't want to be the person to have to decide on who was going home. She was the only person on Malakal to not get a question at Tribal Council. I think that she did have some moments that may have been bordering on CP, but not enough, unfortunately, so MOR it is.
Ami: CP4
Ami's visibility might make more sense at a 3, since she was only really shown after Malakal lost the Immunity Challenge, but then again, she did have 3 confessionals and a Tribal Council question, so a 4 would probably be deserved. She was very strategic in the last scene, trying to arrange a 3-2-1 vote to take out Ozzy and was of her confessionals was about explaining this plan. She also got the typical "swing vote"-type confessional right before Tribal Council where she said that she didn't know if she would turn on Ozzy and that the vote was a big decision. At Tribal Council, she got a question about voting out the big threats and choosing the best time to get rid of them, which Ozzy figured was talking about him. Overall, I definitely think she was CP again in this episode.
Cirie: MOR5
Hmm. This is probably the most difficult rating for me to determine this week. Cirie got a lot of facetime and confessionals in this episode; some of it seemed to lean more towards an OTT type of edit, while some of it showed more complexity. I think her edit was pretty well-balanced in terms of both, so I have decided to simply go with MOR. She had confessionals about the Ozzy/Erik relationship, the boat expedition, and then one about Amanda seeing Ozzy's arrogance. At Tribal Council, she got a question backing up Tracy about Ozzy being called the leader because the tribe checks with him 90% of the time. I did sense a slight negative tone, but it definitely did not seem like that was the intent. I would almost say Mixed (since some of her comments seemed more light-hearted and had her laughing), but that doesn't feel right either.
Erik: OTT3
I think the description "a wide-eyed kid in a candy store" perfectly sums up Erik's edit in this episode - not just towards winning the Reward, but towards Ozzy as well. He has had numerous confessionals about being in awe of Ozzy and that trend continued into this episode where there was a little scene about Ozzy and Erik climbing coconut trees. It all seemed very one-note to me; we only really got to see that one side of Erik, so I think a toneless OTT perfectly captures Erik's edit.
Ozzy: OTTN5
A note to TheLurkerSpeaks: I did see your post late on Wednesday night and I apologize because I didn't have a chance to properly respond to you. I can definitely understand your argument for why Ozzy should have been OTTN, and I think that even if he wasn't quite there last week, he was definitely OTTN this time. (I don't think the edits were exactly the same both weeks). This week, Ozzy almost came across to me the same way that Guatemala Stephenie did in her early confessionals about Lydia and Brianna doing terrible at challenges. He had that same kind of rant about the chicken situation. Not only did we see a lot of arrogance from him, but there was also a lot of denial as well when he said that he wasn't the tribe's leader (notice the reaction shots from tribemates who clearly thought he was). I still can't eliminate Ozzy after this week, but he's extremely, extremely close to it now. I could see either a 4 or 5 visibility for him.
Tracy: MOR3
The fact that Tracy wasn't shown on Exile Island was an immediate flag that she might be voted out in this episode. I'm a little disappointed by her edit this time because they could have sent her off on a very positive note, but it was just a typical MOR edit - not even a positive tone. Her only confessional was about Ozzy not wanting to kill the chickens: she said he's in control of the tribe, he tells people when they eat and what they can eat (that sounds like Dave in my China fanfic!) and it's crazy. She said he'll win if they don't take him out, which is very interesting because there's now been a few comments made about him being in the game for a long time. Other than that, she really wasn't seen until after Malakal lost Immunity, where she was involved in some strategy discussion with the girls. Finally, she had two Tribal Council questions: one where she once again called Ozzy the leader and the other one where she said that Ozzy would be a bigger threat to the girls so it makes more sense for them to vote him out instead of her.
POSSIBLE WINNERS:
1) Parvati (she did dip again for another UTR1, but I have to keep in mind that her tribe has never gone to Tribal Council, there's been people quitting to take away opportunities for her to be shown, and other people have worse flaws with their edits) 2) Cirie (I've decided to un-eliminate Cirie after this episode, although she has a few weaknesses: namely, the low visibility Episode 1, and then getting 2 5s in Episodes 2 and 3, but I do think that those would be difficult to avoid given the story; the other disadvantage is that one of the recaps painted her decision to vote out Yau-Man as a negative betrayal, and I'm not sure that they would do that with the winner, but all of that aside, she's definitely been playing the game and has gotten a strong edit) 3) Eliza (has been very strong all around, but lacks the opening confessional in Episode 1; I do not think that she should be INV1 in this episode, so that keeps her in the running for now) 4) Ozzy (he's just about eliminated now for this OTTN, but one thing I did want to respond to TheLurkerSpeaks about: I said that there was doubt created by Erik and Tracy saying that Ozzy would be "invincible." This is a different form of creating doubt (in my opinion) because it because one thinks "Ozzy's supposed to be invincible. That means he can't make it to the end because it would be too obvious, right?" So there is doubt created about whether or not Ozzy really will make it to the end or if he is in fact invincible)
If, in the very slim chance, a Fan wins the game, it will be Alexis due to her opening confessional (yes, I know that some of you hate that it keeps being brought up). In trying to think of what the editors would do, it's an obvious thing to give the winner that type of confessional, but at the same time, it could easily mean nothing just like Jason's and Tracy's confessionals about being Fans apparently did/do. But I also feel like Alexis has been deliberately given fluffy confessionals (and even a confessional like the one in Episode 7 where she said "The game goes on") just to keep her from being totally INV1 and that's something I pick up on as well. I definitely think that the four Favorites I listed above have way better edits than Alexis, but still, I just can't eliminate her yet.
ELIMINATED BY EDGIC:
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AnneZob |
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I posted this on another thread but I thought I would post it here because I have yet to see anyone in Edgic actually bring this up. I edited it to remove any
possible spoilers because this was originally in the spoiler forum. No, there are no definitive winner spoilers.
To add further to this - doesn't anyone else find the treatment of nuMalakal's losing streak strange? Usually a team loses challenge after challenge the focus is on how weak they are e.g. Ulong, Raro. However, despite the fact that nuMalakal keeps on losing challenges they are presented as strong, tough, competitors. Well, at least the favs on nuMalakal are. The fans are presented as weak, physically and/or mentally. The "toughest" fav Tracy is still presented as being a victim of the fav steamroller. We're supposed to root for her but we know she's going to go. It not only goes against the grain of what usually happens in Survivor but in terms of common sense. This team is losing all the time, but the editors want us to think of them (the favs at least) as tough and strong? Huh? This is very heavy manipulation and I find it strange been that there hasn't been much mention of it in Edgic. Anyway, leaving out the letters, the manipulation to make us think a losing team is strong etc. all point to the fact that nuMalakal aka the fav team is supposed to be negative, but very strong and tough. All this leads to the point. When Ulong and Raro went on their losing streak the winner was on the winning tribe. Hence the focus was on how strong Koror or Aitu were and how weak Ulong and Raro were. If the winner is on the winning tribe again why are the editors treating the losing team as the strong team and not playing up how brilliant the winning team is? This is not just supposition - in the past in the exact situation they *have* gone on and on about the strength of the winning team and the weakness of the losing team. It would make the most sense if the winner was on Malakal and they win by being strong, either physically or in strategy. Sure you can't get around the fact that Malakal is losing all the time but you can try to ignore it as much as possible and just try to present them as strong anyway. This is extremely heavy manipulation on the parts of the editors. They are trying to rewrite events to fit their narrative. BTW this is nothing to do with whether or not Malakal was taking up the time by going to TC all the time or the evacuations. They could do this as easily by using the Malakal time leading to TC to focus on how weak spineless players they are who can't even win a damn challenge. Someone then commented that in Guatemala when New Yaxha went on a losing streak there was also no real focus on "man that team is weak!" Of course the winner of Guatemala was on the team on the losing streak... I was just thinking of a reason why they might leave out the letters scene. Precisely because we have Malakel being fuzzy and warm. However the image we are being presented of Malakal is a bunch of hard strategic players. Remember Eric's speech after Joel's boot where he calls the favs a bunch of hard tough players? A fuzzy letter scene doesn't fit in well with the image they are trying to present of Malakel. In fact it might leave the audience somewhat disorientated if they suddenly have these hard-ass players hugging each other and crying their eyes out. On the other hand the scenes they are cutting out of the other team are strategic scenes. The editors are trying hard to present Airai on a more emotional level, even fluffy - they are not playing so hard, they are not as strategic etc. Both are manipulations of course. Malakel is more negative, but also presented as the complex strategic team full of tough players. Airai is more positive but is also presented as more fluffy (we get complex strategizing in Malakel, in Airai we get Alexis' fluffy confessionals and Parvati flirting) with people not as hard playing. Malakel had this image even before the swap actually. Despite the fact that both teams have fans and favs on them, nuMalakel inherits the spirit of the original Malakel, the fav team. If the winner is a fav they will come from Malakel, if it is fan they will come from Airai. BTW I am pretty sure Alexis won't win from the editing.
Last Edited By: AnneZob
03/21/08 1:02 PM.
Edited 6 times.
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wallduck |
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Why did they cut Ami into that scene?Ami was edited throughout the episode toward one purpose-to set up the false suspense of TC. Massive manipulation, all to make us think there was a real chance that Ozzie would get the boot, when, in reality, the vote wasn't close. Nice example of editing to make something out of nothing. |
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AnneZob |
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Just checked - in the 3 tribal councils NuMalakal went to Jeff only asked one question/made a comment on the lines of their repeated inability to win
challenges. And even then it immediately segued into strategy questions which reference the post-merge and end game. No talk about geez is your tribe
dysfunctional or what and why the hell do you keep on losing or what does it feel like to lose all the time (common questions in the past to teams on losing
streaks) but plenty of talk about the power structure in the tribe (not related to the dysfunctionality). Jeff's single "You are losing all the time
comment" is prefunctory at best. This is *not* the usual treatment of a team that is on a losing streak. This has nothing to do with with the evictions
taking up Airai's screen time as this time would have been reserved for Malakal anyway and say if they didn't have enough time on Airai to push the
fact that Airai is dominant and Malakal is falling apart they could do it in the designated time for Malakal. I mean if the winner is on Airai and all of
Malakal are losers why do we need to hear about the *end game* of the players on Malakal when we can hear about how pathetic they are and by implication how
great Airai are? I mean this has been the modus operandus for teams on losing streaks in the past when the winner is on the dominant team in the past...In fact
given that so much of Airai's time is taken up by quits/evacuations the use of the Malakal time to push Airai's strength is even more critical.
Apparently however the most important thing for us to hear in the TC is the end game of the tribe that can't seem to win a challenge.
Last Edited By: AnneZob
03/21/08 2:51 PM.
Edited 2 times.
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Kitty Pryde1 |
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That actually makes a lot of sense, Anne.
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StevenRN |
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chaperone wrote:
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unduli clone |
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BlakeB717 wrote: Somebody take Aras' million dollars back!
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DevilChild255 |
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StevenRN - taking into consideration that Ami doesn't trust Cirie and vice versa, little chance of that happening as of what we've been shown |
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BlakeB717 |
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Aras wasn't a returning player, uc. Her edit revolves around... well, I don't even really know what her story is. I guess just
surviving, and trying to take out Parvati (which she continues to fail at). I'm having trouble picturing her in the end-game because all her alliances are
going down the tubes. She needs something big next episode.
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fat little fingers |
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Episode 7: "Previously on..." Sequence of shots in the "Drop your buffs!" scene: Note: The switch is shown as the continuing story of the Couple Alliance and Eliza. ![]() ![]()
![]() ![]()
Jeff, "After the switch, it became obvious how much the fans suffered." ...
James, "I'm amazed they're still alive, poor things. They should be dead!"
Jeff, "And how much the Favorites thrived." (Shot of Ozzy fishing.)
Eric, "Those guys are tough as nails!"
Jeff, "The new Airai jelled immediately." ![]() ![]()
Jeff reminds us of the whole Ozzy fake idol, Jason dumb enough to buy it story. This obviously is getting ready to have another Ozzy triumph, as Jason makes a fool of himself and goes out.
At the IC: Cirie, "Help me! Help me!" Jeff, "Cirie is losing it!"
Cirie continues, "Help me! Help me!" At TC: Jeff, "...leaving two fans, Tracy and Eric, on Ozzy's tribe." ![]() ![]()
There is a whole lot to think about in this recap. The focus of the tribe switch is Eliza and the Couples Alliance. The theme of the "poor" "suffering" Fans and the "thriving", "tough as nails" Faves is hammered again. This recap introduces New Malakal as "Ozzy's tribe". Alexis continues to get isolated face time that tells me she will be a part of the end game. I think all the "Edgic" arguments for Eliza's challenge scenes to pump up her Ep7 edit is unwise. But, she does close the Reward Challenge scene, which is notable. If you do something as doofy as Jason is about to do, SEG will use you and throw you away like a dirty snot rag. It's comin', Jason. Anyone want to comment on the scene of Cirie screaming, "Help me! Help me!', while Jeff pronounces, "Cirie is losing it!"? |
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Warrior |
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never mind...
Last Edited By: Warrior
03/21/08 6:49 PM.
Edited 1 times.
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scepticA |
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Aras wasn't a returning player, uc.Blake, the edgic semi-assumption about opening confessional as critical isn't an absolute, as Aras's edit demonstrates. By saying that this season is different because Aras wasn't a returning player vs. Eliza is a returning player is falling into a trap many of us have done this year: speculate that because there are returnees the edit will be different. If that's the case regarding the opening confessional (as you are suggesting), why stop there? If one edgic semi-rule is wrong because of returnee status, why not others? If we go down that line of thinking we can disregard almost every edgic rule. Past seasons are guides, and just about every edgic "rule" has qualifiers or edits that bend or break them. I seek the trends that most closely match what we've gleaned from prior seasons, and I assume others here do the same. The lack of an opening confessional from Eliza is a negative/worry in her edit, that's for sure. But Parv and Cirie also have edgic negative/worries. But none of these negatives are deal-breakers for any of them. |
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