S-16 Edgic (editing and logic)

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OnlyTheHunter		#2341	[-]
Posts: 1410 (03/15/08 12:52 AM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Got an admission to make. It's a big one. I unfortunately know spoilers. Six, in fact. Now how did it happen? Well, it seems I can't avoid them. I've seen six of them so far. In case you want in on the action, so far I've seen them every Thursday at 8pm on channel 10, but I think they make everyone's channels different, so they can prove that no one "accidentally" sees them. They post them to a forum called CBS (Could Be Spoilers????) I got a tip, the next one is actually moved up to Wednesday this coming week, to mess with everybody. Watch it, then post here, and everyone will think you're really smart when you've really watched the spoilers. Michael "The Watcher" Reed :-)
Kitty Pryde1		#2342	[-]
Posts: 3070 (03/15/08 1:08 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Tracy Hughes-Wolf Watchdog Report: Week 6! Recap: Tracy is said to have been used by the favorites to blindside Joel, which I had forgotten. Her chances are certainly lessened from that. Malakal Scene 1: She gets a reaction shot to Erik's speech about voting Joel off, but that's it. Malakal Scene 2: Tracy is shown, talking to Chet about how it wasn't a bad decision to turn on their fellow fan because he was already planning on turning on them. She gets a confessional about how Joel's stupidity basically screwed her over, which seems to be a running theme in that she's the only fan who's actually playing with her head and working to turn things in her favor, and it's hurting her because if everyone else is stupid, it doesn't matter how smart you are. She then gives her underdog speech about how she didn't come this far to give up. She comments on how vicious the favorites are and is once again shown working her charm and charisma on Erik to keep him on their side. She once again is shown having to explain to Erik the numbers game, seemingly talking to him like a child. She's then shown talking with Ami, who comments about having a pep talk with Tracy. This scene in particular strikes me as important, because it's essentially saying that Ami Cusack, the man-hating uber bitch of Vanuatu, is actively trying to help someone who is not in her alliance. Once again, I this this will come up if Ami is on the jury: she will vote for a fan. The scene definitely seems to go out of its way to show Tracy as the go-to girl for the fans, because we see Chet and Erik looking on, yet Tracy's the one Ami goes to. Reward Challenge: She gets mentioned by Jeff as working with Ozzy on their blockade. She's then shown pushing on a board to get it into place in comparison to Chet, standing around doing nothing. Malakal Scene 3: The favorites talk about how she's a builder, yet she didn't help them in the challenge, which is strange, given the times she was featured during the reward, where she was shown working hard. This scene is probably more negative for the faves than meaningful to Tracy, though. Cirie is also shown commenting on Tracy's age (incorrectly) which is more negativity for the faves once again. Tracy is the fan shown when Ami talks about wanting to help them out, and those two are the ones having the conversation in the water about wanting Cirie gone. Tracy is once again shown as being perceptive by correctly assessing Cirie as a player, which Ami concurs with. Ami then gets the scene where she talks about "really trusting" Tracy almost to the point where they come across as BFFs. Immunity Challenge: Tracy is shown as asking where Jonathan is first (although her mouth was moving, I think it was Ami who asked, but it's hard to tell.) She was the one who walked on the poles, but that was about it for her in the challenge, although she did get a doisappointed reaction shot when Airai was just about finished with the challenge. Malakal Scene 4: Tracy is shown as disappointed over Chet basically quitting. She gets several reaction shots, and then she's even shown crying because Chet has basically screwed her over by asking to quit. Erik then gets a confessional where he mentions that Chet would be more honorable if he helped Tracy, Chet's long-time friend. Tracy and Erik are then shown discussing booting Ozzy to out the potential immunity idol. Tracy then gets a confessional about how she understands that Chet is hurt, but she needs him to vote with them in order to keep herself in the game. She then says that she won't put Chet's name down, no matter what. Tracy then gets mentioned multiple times as Erik is trying to coerce Chet into voting for Ozzy, and as Ami talks about potentially voting with the fans, but she's not shown talking to Chet herself. She gets the line "Just think about it, okay." which I think definitely continues to show her as a very calculated player who doesn't let her emotions get the better of her, continuing off of last episode. Chet mentions her again as he said he always promised to help her out in a confessional. Tribal Council: She basically only got reaction shots to several of the comments that were made, but she didn't actually speak, which was new for her going to tribal council. Rating: CP (We saw her thoughts and her feelings in terms of the game.) Tone: Static Neutral (There wasn't really any tone for HER, as there was for the people around her that may have made her look somewhat positive, but I think it was more the negativity that made hr neutrality look positive.) Visibility: 4 (She was definitely 4 material this episode.) Winning Chances: If a fan is going to win the game, which I think will happen, it's going to be Tracy. She's got the numbers, she's got the story, and she's pretty much the only fan than isn't either being portrayed as OTT or UTR/INV. The only bad things about her edit are the INV she's gotten and the ties to Chet and Kathy, which have been severed. Other than that, she's golden. Ratings After Two Watchings: Airai Tribe: Alexis - UTR1 Eliza - MOR2 James - MOR2 Jason - MOR3 Jonathan - OTTPP4 Kathleen - UTRP1 Natalie - INV1 Parvati - UTR2 Malakal Tribe: Amanda - UTRN2 Ami - CPP4 Chet - OTTN4 Cirie - MORN3 Erik - MOR4 Ozzy - MORN4 Tracy - CP4 Winners: (Great) Tracy, Eliza (Good) Parvati, Cirie (Okay) Alexis, Ozzy, Erik (Weak) Jason (Eliminated) James, Kathleen, Natalie, Amanda, Ami
Lemun		#2343	[-]
Posts: 291 (03/15/08 4:38 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Ok what's with all this spoiler stuff in here again? I appreciate Probstfan posting that there aren't confirmed spoilers, but just seeing that one particular name being attached to a supposed spoiler kinda makes me pissed. You can delete it or edit it, but of course it will be stuck in my mind and that kinda sucks. And AAA, can you just go away? Go post in spoilers and leave this thread alone! TIA!
TheLurkerSpeaks		#2344	[-]
Posts: 1159 (03/15/08 6:56 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Tracy was not in any way CP. She was portrayed as a positive underdog, and everything this episode was consistent with that. That's OTTP, not CP. When the negative bashing of the favorites is seen as undeserved, when she gives her "underdog speech", when Erik points out to Chet that Tracy deserves his help, when Ami decides to risk her own position to help her out, that is all positive editing.
TheIsraeliDevil	Ep. 6 Ratings	#2345	[-]
Posts: 2114 (03/15/08 7:45 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Airai Alexis UTR1 - Move on. Nothing here. Eliza MORP2 - The P is for Jonathan's evacuation scene. She's somewhat of a narrator, but we get some insight into her mind too. I wanted to hear about how Jonathan's evacuation affected her, but I guess it was hinted to us. The #1 contender right now, and boy, would I love for her to win. James MOR2 - Maybe N, probably not. He's a minor character this time around. Jason OTT3 - Ozzy says Jason's naive and might fall for the fake idol, Chet says Jason is naive because he even bothers searching... Jason finds the fake idol and is delighted. Definitely OTT, though not with an N intention. Jonathan OTTPP3 - I teared. Kathy UTRP2 - She also gets a P for her response to Jon's evacuation. Natalie INV - Hilarious. Parvati UTR2 - Her edit is a lot like Eliza's, but this week she had less content. I think in the last two weeks Eliza passed her in the winners' race - both were rather quiet, but Eliza's low-visiblity editing had more substance than Parvati's. Malakal Amanda UTR2 - WHY. WAS. SHE. CAST?!?!?! Ami CPP4 - That was a lovely editing for queen Ami. Hopefully she remains a big character and makes it far. Chet OTTN4 - OTTN overall. One of the most pathetic survivors ever. Cirie MOR3 - With shades of N. She wasn't an actual target, but was manipulated to be one. A very good episode for Cirie's winning chances. If only she didn't have that weak ep. 1... Erik MOR3 - With shades of P. He's not the most interesting person there... Ozzy MORN4 - Oh, that was an UGLY editing. Smug and unaware. That might've been worse than his editing in the Billy boot. I wanna say he can't win after this, though he's probably endgame material... Tracy CP4 - Seperate the fact that you (and I) like her from a P editing. She wasn't P, though she's likeable. Her story (like every fan's story, to be fair), seems like an immediate, short-range story, and not endgame. Eliminated: 13. Natalie 12. Amanda 11. Ami 10. James 9. Erik 8. Kathy 7. Alexis 6. Jason A very, very slight chance: 5. Tracy 4. Ozzy Possible winners: 3. Cirie 2. Parvati 1. Eliza
winterland121072		#2346	[-]
Posts: 984 (03/15/08 7:48 AM) MESS member Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Ugh - it is the attack of the non-regulars all opining about who is going to win...
nikkidj	Jason Watchdog Report	#2347	[-]
Posts: 215 (03/15/08 7:49 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Aaah, Jason. What a sweet, bumbling nincompoop. We first see our fearless follower swimming out to sea. He doesn't beat Ozzy, but he does beat Erik, he of the Ozzy man-love. He then starts throwing all of the planks out to his teammates, which Ozzy and Erik promptly copy. For once, our hero had the good idea first, but no comments from Jeff about it. Not good. Then, we have him doing his duty at Exile island. Goofy, nincompoop music plays as he finds Ozzy's fake idol. He even admits "It's not much," but then says "It's pretty incredible." Then he says "This means Ozzy doesn't have it. Sweet!" This after Ozzy states that Jason is naive, which is reinforced by the editing. However, he does pull a smart one and state that "I've come to the conclusion that Ozzy already found it." Ozzy fumbles a bit, says that Jason must not have known where to look, which to my ears was an admission that he in fact had it. But I don't think anyone there caught on to it. Jason avoids OTT by making a savvy move at the end. MOR3. But his chances are dwindling by the episode. My analysis? Late gamer who doesn't make final three. And I am NOT spoiled. So there.
winterland121072		#2348	[-]
Posts: 985 (03/15/08 7:53 AM) MESS member Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Survivor 16 Episode 06 Edgic Ratings Jonathan - "My Only Regret is that I Did Not Win!" OTTPP5 See Watchdog Report Erik - "We're not in Kansas anymore" MOR4 - Eliminated Erik started the episode reflecting about Joel's ousting, opining about the strength of the Favorites. He reflected that an adjustment in his strategy may be necessary in terms of lying and backstabbing. While not absurdly reflective, this scene provided depth to Erik's character. Later Erik made another guest appearance in a passionate attempt to get Chet to oust Ozzy. Erik really has no story at this point. He has been linked to Ozzy in terms of competition, but this has not been recognized by Ozzy. He has been on the wrong side of most votes as well. His story is that he is a Fan who appears contemplative, but just can't figure out the game. Tracy - "I'm a Control Freak - make that a Persuasive Control Freak" CP4 - Eliminated Tracy started the episode also reflecting on Joel's ousting. She shared her strategy for getting rid of Joel, and shared how it is personally affected her (e.g., driving her batty to not be in control). This clearly provided even more depth to the already deep character of Tracy. Tracy is also shown convincing Erik that the Favorites could not be trusted. She suggested to Erik that he was next on the Favorites boot list. This scene further added depth to Tracy's controlling and persuasive power. Tracy concluded that she needed to find one Favorite to make it work. Of course that One Favorite is Ami. And Tracy graciously buy slyly accepted an alliance with Ami. The attempt to get Chet to stay was interesting but the planting of Ami's seed with Tracy - that was the real story. Overall, Tracy's story is likely to be the strongest and most competitive of the Fans. She will likely have go down fight and generate a ton of respect from the editors, but will fail. Amanda - "I'm Hear for Ozzy! - oops - I'm Here for Ozzy!" - Eliminated - UTR2 Amanda's already deep character was further probed by showing her coo and awe over Ozzy while he was preparing food. This scene boosted Ozzy. Amanda also targeted the Fans in general. This scene boosted Ami's defection as she was shown contemplatively reacting to the Favorites parochial view of the game. Don't they know that the theme of this season does not involve ousting the fans but rather involves utilizing the fans. Amanda's odyssey in Micronesia is tied to the development of other characters - not her own. Similar to geriatric couples, Amanda will be ousted soon after Ozzy's demise. Ami - "I'm the One Favorite Tracy's Lookin' For" CP4 - Eliminated Ami described the plight of the Fans and showed a sense of empathy. This was heavily manipulated to be a positive insight for Ami. She explained her struggle with staying loyal to the Favorites or starting a new loyalty with the Fans. Clearly, this was a CP moment for Ami - the first of the season. She stated to Tracy that she was the bottom of the rung at ol' Malakal, and being poop pants. A touching moment - poor Ami. Ami's first CP moment was less about her, and more about Tracy's story. Tracy was looking for the One Favorite whom she could flip, and Ami was the One Favorite. The story of Micronesia has finally found some use for the Queen of Vanuatu - to advance Tracy's character. Later in the episode the conversation between Tracy and Ami is continued. Shark imagery is again provided to Ami. Ami continues to express her conflict between the Fans and the Favorites. Will she be able to keep her secret alliance with the Fans a clandestine alliance? Interestingly, it is ironic that in Ami's Vanuatu story centered around her ability to manipulate, whereas the first inkling of a story for her in Micronesia is centered around her fitting into someone else's story. An even higher amount of irony is that in a season where the strongest contenders for victory (edgically) are women - that contender group does not comprise Ami. James - "Did You See That?" MOR2 - Eliminated James commented on how motivating Jonathan is and how it would be a loss to the Airai Tribe if they lost Jonathan. But, instead of wrapping up his statement with a Capital P, he ended his commentary stating that Jonathan's loss would put make him "stuck with a bunch of girls and he'd lose his mind." Later in the episode, almost sarcastically from an editing perspective, he is asked how he feels about all the ladies - he puts his thumb up in response. In reflecting on Jonathan's evacuation, he lamented his persuasive ability. Perhaps such a comment could be construed as revealing James' struggle in the game. James's character is that of the Narrator. He observes and comments. He is never shown observing, commenting and acting. Eliza - "There's A Bigger Picture - And I Like It!" CP2 - Winner Contender Eliza noted to the viewer that she and Jonathan would be targeting James / Parvati through utilizing the Fans. This was a hugely complicated and strategic comment that showed that Fans as Pawns for her ultimate strategy. Was this a game shifting event? Indeed, this could be the key to this season - Which Favorite Will Exploit the Fans to their Advantage. Whereas Ami was shown allying with Tracy for her personal survival (e.g., I was last on the Malakal rung), Eliza was shown as seeing the Fans as a means to an end - as pawns (e.g., I will use the Fans to take out Parvati). Eliza is highlighted throughout the challenges with reaction shots, and throughout the Penner evacuation. Eliza's chances of winning are very strong. Kathy - "Eliza Needs Me More Than I Need Jonathan!" OTTP2 - Eliminated Kathy's big moment for the episode involved boosting Jonathan's OTTPP exit. It was dramatic as she cried and said she needs him. It was pathetic in that she was a blubbering mess despite only knowing him for three days. What Kathy doesn't know if how badly Eliza needs her now. Parvati - "I'd Flirt with The Spin Cycle If I Could" - UTR2 - Winner Contender Parvati's entrance into the episode started with her asking one of the Micronesian men if he was married. Her character is about flirting and manipulating men (e.g., déjà vu?), but her character is trying to burst from this mold. She was shown learning from the Micronesians (e.g., she figured out the night bait trap) (e.g., she was shown figuring out the fishing tricks). Cirie - "I'm In a Holding Episode Right Now" - UTR3 - Winner Contender Cirie was given enough air-time to avoid the dreaded INV, but not much more. She was shown opining about whether Jason was going to find the Immunity Idol, and she complained about not wanting to have to teach the Fans how to play the game. It will be interesting to see how Cirie's story progresses. Parvati was her main ally with the 4-Click, and now she is stuck with Ami (who confessed during this episode that she hasn't gotten over the Yau ousting), and Ozzy / Amanda (who we know from previous episodes do not trust Cirie). If Cirie feels comfortable, she may be in for trouble. Ami has made the move to the Fans. Will she too? Ozzy - "In Case You Didn't Know, I Have The Immunity Idol" - MORN4 Eliminated Ozzy again described his Immunity Idol story. He asserted how hopeful he is that Jason finds the fake idol, and during Tribal Council his arrogance was dragged out for everyone to see. Ozzy's story is all about the idol - not about winning. His mixture of arrogance within the Idol Story suggests that it will be his downfall. He was nearly voted out and had no idea. Chet - (to the music of Beck) "I'm A Loser Baby, So Why Don't You Kill Me" - OTTN - Eliminated Chet sucks. Jason - "Pick me - I clearly am a Pawn!" MOR3 - Eliminated Jason found the Immunity Idol - not. A close up was shown of the stick he found - at best he should have been skeptically optimistic. Interestingly, though, he did allege that Ozzy likely has the Immunity Idol. An ironic strategy considering that he believes he has the idol. Jason has no story outside of being ripe for manipulatin' by a Favorite (cough, ahem, - Eliza, cough). Alexis - "My Biggest Asset is that Some People at Edgic Like Me!" - UTR1 Eliminated Alexis commented that the dinner with the Micronesian men was great. Her story is about as bland as the meal she was critiquing. The question for Alexis is which Favorite she will help define. Natalie - INV1 - Eliminated Contenders: Eliza / Cirie / Parvati
winterland121072		#2349	[-]
Posts: 986 (03/15/08 7:58 AM) MESS member Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Watchdog Report - Jonathan Penner - Episode 06 OTTPP Jonathan - "My Only Regret is that I Did Not Win!" Indeed, the Penner story came to an end. His character started with CP and created the complicated and strategic ambiance of Malakal. With his injury, however, his tone became one-dimensional as the editors wanted to drive home his aura. Penner was penultimately given a strategists edit, but ultimately he was given the edit of a true fan of the game of Survivor. His story was important and shouldn't be neglected. He advanced the characters of Cirie, Eliza and Paravati. Arguably, through five episodes, his edit was the most valuable. For example, the arguing with Cirie permitted that editors to display Cirie's ability to persuade. His unsuccessful targeting of Parvati warned the viewers of her game ability. His alliance with Eliza highlighted her plight as his control diminished.
nikkidj		#2350	[-]
Posts: 216 (03/15/08 7:59 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	AIRAI Alexis: UTR1. "Fish stew tastes great!" And is less filling, too. Eliza: MOR2. James: CP2. I gave him CP because he did show some self awareness, noting that he's not very persuasive or talkative. He knows this is detrimental to him, since all the girls are what he is NOT. He's not just bummed about being the last guy there, he's bummed because he knows this places him in jeopardy. Jonathan: OTTPP3 Kathy: UTRP1 Natalie: INV1. Meow. Purrrrrrrrrrr. Parv: UTR2. Did note that they could use the reward every day, then is shown catching the fish, using what she's learned. MALAKAL Amanda: MOR3. Wouldn't argue against a negative. Ami: CPP4. Doesn't like the fan bashing, is open to alligning with different people, and noting that Cirie is not to be trusted. I just lurve her, and am bummed that she's getting such a crappy edit. Cirie: UTR3. See a negative here, too. "I don't wanna teach, I wanna play." Snot. Chet: MORN4. What a stinking, self-centered whiner. Especially when juxtaposed with Jonathan. Erik: CP4. Realizes that he's going to have to start lying to play the game. Ozzy: MORN4. What an arrogant piece of work. Tracy: CP3. Eliminated: Chet, Amanda, James, Kathy, Natalie Hanging on by a thread: Alexis, Jason, Ami, Erik, Tracy Not bad: Ozzy, Cirie Battle of the broads: Eliza, Parvati Last Edited By: nikkidj 03/15/08 8:05 AM. Edited 1 times.
OnlyTheHunter		#2351	[-]
Posts: 1411 (03/15/08 8:09 AM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	TID, I have only one question about your rankings, because it is intriguing for me. Eliza MORP2 - The P is for Jonathan's evacuation scene. She's somewhat of a narrator, but we get some insight into her mind too. I wanted to hear about how Jonathan's evacuation affected her, but I guess it was hinted to us. The #1 contender right now, and boy, would I love for her to win. Parvati UTR2 - Her edit is a lot like Eliza's, but this week she had less content. I think in the last two weeks Eliza passed her in the winners' race - both were rather quiet, but Eliza's low-visiblity editing had more substance than Parvati's. I was coming the other way. Eliza simply hopes she might make a move with Jonathan, which of course can't happen now, and we get nothing about it afterwards. No "I'm now in danger" moments, etc. Whereas Parvati's alliance is targeted (by Eliza no less), giving her concern she isn't shown to see coming, and then we see her appreciate and use knowledge after the RC, we see her grow a bit. I felt if anything, she had more content and substance than Eliza, in this episode at least. I'm just giving an idea out there. I've had trouble buying Eliza all season. What did you see that apparently I can't? I'm wanting to give Eliza a better look. Michael
TheIsraeliDevil	I dunno...	#2352	[-]
Posts: 2115 (03/15/08 8:30 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I may wanna watch again (I always base my ratings on just one viewing), but I remembered Eliza making game comments, talking to Jonathan about their position, then being emphasized (though I admit I'm worried about her not getting a confessional) at Jonathan's evacuation scene. That was MORP. Parvati only commented on the reward, which Eliza did too.
OnlyTheHunter		#2353	[-]
Posts: 1411 (03/15/08 8:47 AM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	TID, thanks. I'm not questioning the actual rankings (MOR Eliza and UTR Parvati, that sounds right). It was more a question about "meaningful edit." Where I can see intent to make you think about Parvati, UTR or not, Eliza...eee, not so much. I've felt that way all season. She has the same aura of narrator that she had in Vanuatu to me. She's great for comments about others and where she thinks she stands, but not so much for anything that would make me see that she's a person in her own right. Does that make sense? FLF is going to laugh at me, I'm actual playing devil's advocate for other players beyond my pick. And I've figured out how Natalie wins. It's a setup...all the jurors and the other 2 on the F3 discover a satellite feed back at camp and watch American Idol, while Natalie is the only one at Final TC with Probst and wins by default. That's the ticket! Michael
colleenlover		#2354	[-]
Posts: 7953 (03/15/08 9:22 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Michael, Eliza has the music cues -which in Burnett land are never subtle. Yes, we didn't see the follow-up to Penner's evacuation, but there was a lot to cram into this episode. After the Jonathan and Eliza scene, or actually capping it off, when Penner talks about new life in the game, the camera ends the scene with a shot of Eliza and the music hits a note. -Also, during the Cirie/Jonathan argument at TC in episode three, Eliza gets the gong on her inserted close-up, and the manipulated camera shots to show she is the only one to catch Probst's reactions and Parvati's answers. So far of the underdogs, she is the only one to have been given threads for down the line as opposed to Tracy and her crew which are moment by moment. And hell, Jonathan and she have a manipulated scene in which he tells her, "Try to see the big picture." Why did we have to see her worried about Cirie not being with them as opposed to Yau Man or Ami seeing it? When she was plotting against Jonathan with Parvati why did we have it smoothed over by both Parvati and Jonathan? The chicken coup scene where Eliza talks about her head is on the chopping block? Parvati's episode one comment, "I don't want to get snaked by Eliza?" (why not Ami, Yau Man or especially Jonathan?) Why show imagery of Eliza as a butterfly in a spider web, trapped but not eaten, and then cut to the spider as Cirie? *A lot of time and craft has been given to Eliza's edit.
colleenlover		#2355	[-]
Posts: 7953 (03/15/08 9:22 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	yuku sucks. goodbye long post -gone forever.
colleenlover		#2356	[-]
Posts: 7953 (03/15/08 9:23 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	yuku sucks. goodbye long, lengthy post -gone forever.
OnlyTheHunter		#2357	[-]
Posts: 1412 (03/15/08 9:52 AM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	CL, at work here, sometimes I click Post and I get an error message and it posted anyway, sometimes not. It's not about the time spent or the length, it's the randomness you are supposed to love about Yuku. Eliza is certainly important. I guess my hangup is Parvati's threads are better and Eliza seems like an intregal part, but Eliza is, in my non-thought out first run analysis, Parvati's impediment. A lot of what you wrote supports that. Her story is getting to be, "Can I beat Parvati?" She's flop sweat. She narrated the reward, but Parvati catches the fish and tells us about the experience. Eliza defines Parvati, but isn't defining herself very much. You are very right, she has "new life". But where was her concern about losing the alliance she had? Her plan now is to join up with the fans and boot Parvati and James before the merge. But there's no content with the fans given. It's just direct, "I should do this," and then it sits, waiting for Parvati or someone else to undo it. Parvati's has been how she herself will improve and change. Personal growth. She flirts, but there's more to her. She has James and the couples, but she sees beyond it. She gets doubt about her ability to make it to the merge when she can't be voted out that episode. I think she's lasting a while, but if so, care is brought to give the precariousness of her situation. Eliza is actually in one, but the edit give her a stronger, "new life" position. Add in James' fear of the women, and we think Eliza is possibly in a better spot now, and Parvati is in a worse one. Manipulated? I think so. And yet we see nothing of how Eliza can be sure of it. But after Penner left, the time for that tribe to be featured ended. Next episode will be interesting seeing some dynamics there. Michael
colleenlover		#2358	[-]
Posts: 7953 (03/15/08 10:03 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I agree 100%. And I'm not picking Eliza over Parvati -or vice versa. It would be the same as picking Todd over Courntey last season at this stage. The narrative has been set up to accomodate either outcome. Does Eliza beat Parvati or the opposite? Both have merit at this stage. How can I successfully rule one out without it being a blind shot in the dark? I could say the intro of episode one rules out Eliza, but then if she wins, we'll be starting next season stating DO NOT put stock in opening shots. All I can look at right now is manipulation for the story -and the three main personal stories are Eliza, Parvati and Cirie. (I could make a case for Ozzy too -but his seems more about battling people as a whole, and not individual foreshadowing).
RageBot		#2359	[-]
Posts: 79 (03/15/08 10:16 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	CL, just ctrl+c whenever you write a post, just do it everytime.
Kitty Pryde1		#2360	[-]
Posts: 3071 (03/15/08 10:25 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I just think there's a lot more detracting from Parvati's edit than there is supporting it. The pee-water comment and asking the Micronesian if he was married come to mind. Those just don't seem like things that needed to be shown, yet they WERE shown in association with Parvati.

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S-16 Edgic (editing and logic)

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